1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

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911car
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1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by 911car » Sat Jul 25, 2015 7:13 am

Enlisted type, despite the name tag for an Unteroffizier

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Khukri
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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by Khukri » Sat Jul 25, 2015 7:33 am

Great helmet !

Do you have pics of the sideposts/Kokarden.

Thank you !!!

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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by 911car » Sat Jul 25, 2015 10:04 am

Thank you Francis.
Just the regular M95 posts and enlisted type prussian/Reich cockades; nothing special...

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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by Khukri » Sat Jul 25, 2015 2:41 pm

Ok, thank you !
Francis

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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by b.loree » Sat Jul 25, 2015 2:42 pm

That is a very nice helmet Bruno. Love those Regt markings! :thumb up:
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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by joerookery » Sat Jul 25, 2015 5:50 pm

I was always under the impression that a Fahnenjunker in a dragoon regiment was called a Coranet. This proves otherwise. Perhaps it changed when the language changed? French influence to German influence?
VR/Joe
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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by 911car » Sun Jul 26, 2015 5:39 am

joerookery wrote:I was always under the impression that a Fahnenjunker in a dragoon regiment was called a Coranet. This proves otherwise. Perhaps it changed when the language changed? French influence to German influence?
This only applied to muslims, Joe...

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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by Adler » Sun Jul 26, 2015 10:33 am

Very impressive helmet!

Adler

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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by kaiser » Mon Jul 27, 2015 3:30 am

nice helmet aspecially with the extra bandeau
the name.tag in it is a nice extra as well to all the markings
now you can dig into it to find out its total history to this man
=D>

jonas

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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by ww1czechlegion » Wed Jul 29, 2015 9:14 am

That is an incredibly beautiful and rare helmet Bruno, congratulations! :bravo:

The markings are fantastic, and the original owner's label inside is the icing on the cake! =D>

Thanks for sharing photos of it with us! :thumb up:

Best Regards,

Alan

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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by Westfront » Fri Jul 31, 2015 6:18 am

Very impressive helmet well done :bravo: .

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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by verdun16 » Fri Jul 31, 2015 1:56 pm

A great helmet, rare and in mint condition
As always
verdun 16

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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by J.LeBrasseur » Fri Jul 31, 2015 2:34 pm

Bruno- that is a great find, love the wappen and name tag. As others said, a great helmet.

Best

James
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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by Spiker » Wed Aug 19, 2015 8:14 am

Super fine helmet ! congrads. :thumb up:
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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by poniatowski » Thu Sep 24, 2015 2:15 pm

Certainly is a beauty! Thanks for sharing the photos.

:D Ron
I really do need to know more about this....

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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by KAGGR#1 » Sun Jan 17, 2016 1:40 pm

A very rare helmet .
I M O a marked enlisted Dragoon helmet
is harder to find than an officers form the same
regiment. In my collecting of 45 years
I have seen very few marked e m dragoon helmets .
Yours is to a rare regiment .
I have the officers D R 9 but no e m
Steve

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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by Glennj » Sun Jan 17, 2016 3:43 pm

We can pretty much date this helmet exactly. Fahnenjunker-Unteroffizier Weichert of Dragoner-Regiment Nr. 9 was promoted to Fähnrich on 22 March 1914 and commissioned as a Leutnant (without Patent) on 10 August 1914. He subsequently received seniority from 20 November 1912 (20.11.12 K). He survived the war and retired as an Oberleutnant a.D.

Regards
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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by joerookery » Sun Jan 17, 2016 3:59 pm

Glenn, do you have anything to say about the Fahnenjunker v Coronet comment?
VR/Joe
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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by Glennj » Sun Jan 17, 2016 4:49 pm

Joe,

I will need to do a bit of checking but I think you will find that the rank of Cornet disappeared from the Prussian Army following the disasters of 1806 and the subsequent reorganisation of the army. The rank of Cornet was the equivalent Cürassier and Husaren rank of that of Fähnrich, which at the time was the lowest commissioned rank.

Regards
Glenn

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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by Glennj » Mon Jan 18, 2016 2:19 am

Joe,

as an addition. The Order of 6 August 1808 concerning officer recruitment introduced the rank of Portrpee-Fähnrich as a senior officer aspirant and the previous (commissioned ranks of Fähnrich and Cornett were discontinued. Here is a page from the 1806 Prussian Army Rangliste showing the junior commissioned officers of Regiment Usedom Husaren Nr. 10. The Dragoons used the rank of Fähnrich.

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Glenn

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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by joerookery » Mon Jan 18, 2016 5:20 am

Thank you Glenn! Your next mission Mr. Phelps should you decide to accept it is to answer the same question about artillery guys. When did they stop being Stück-Junkers?
VR/Joe
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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by Glennj » Mon Jan 18, 2016 8:51 am

Joe,
to answer the same question about artillery guys. When did they stop being Stück-Junkers?
At the same time as above; following the reorganisation of the "old Army".

Regards
Glenn

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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by 911car » Thu Feb 04, 2016 3:26 am

Glennj wrote:We can pretty much date this helmet exactly. Fahnenjunker-Unteroffizier Weichert of Dragoner-Regiment Nr. 9 was promoted to Fähnrich on 22 March 1914 and commissioned as a Leutnant (without Patent) on 10 August 1914. He subsequently received seniority from 20 November 1912 (20.11.12 K). He survived the war and retired as an Oberleutnant a.D.

Regards
Glenn
I had missed this, Glenn. I cannot believe you managed to trace Herr Weichert back to 1914!! This is amazing. Thank you so much.
Bruno

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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by Tony without Kaiser » Thu Feb 04, 2016 4:48 pm

That is astounding. I have never seen another issued example like this, and the condition is equally amazing. A dream Dragoner helmet. Makes my brain hurt that is so rare :shaking:
Kaiser: 09 July 1997 - 12 October 2010.
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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by b.loree » Mon Feb 08, 2016 6:14 pm

This helmet, it's condition and identification of its owner is just amazing, fantastic....whatever adjective you can think of!! I think of the cloth ID tag...animal based glue, lasting for that long, just so hard to believe!!! Kudos to Glenn as well, man...we give you a name and it's like dealing with Sherlock Holmes, you track him down. :thumb up:
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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by joerookery » Tue Feb 09, 2016 6:47 am

Kudos to Glenn as well, man...we give you a name and it's like dealing with Sherlock Holmes, you track him down. :thumb up:
:thumb up: True that and a nice guy too!
VR/Joe
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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by argonne » Sat Jul 16, 2016 1:03 pm

I read this topic very lately...

Glenn could start the story of the wearer. Here is the end.

Felix Weichert, Leutnant at the 4/DR9, born a 28.8. in Berlin, has been taken prisoner August 1915.

http://des.genealogy.net/search/show/1863810" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

He came back from captivity very early, April 1918. Very uncommon (maybe heavy disease...)

http://des.genealogy.net/search/show/2999528" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Philippe
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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by KAGGR#1 » Wed Aug 01, 2018 3:17 pm

Bruno ;
On the D R 9 front plate the 2 battle honors on each side of the eagle are made
as part of the eagle plate . Unlike the officers , where a lot of times the battle honors are added to the eagle .
I can't tell about the "Waterloo " battle honor around the neck . Is it made with the eagle also , of added on ?
That helmet is really great .
Thanks
Steve McFarland

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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by 911car » Wed Aug 01, 2018 3:31 pm

KAGGR#1 wrote:
Wed Aug 01, 2018 3:17 pm
Bruno ;
On the D R 9 front plate the 2 battle honors on each side of the eagle are made
as part of the eagle plate . Unlike the officers , where a lot of times the battle honors are added to the eagle .
I can't tell about the "Waterloo " battle honor around the neck . Is it made with the eagle also , of added on ?
That helmet is really great .
Thanks
Steve McFarland
Sorry, Steve, I had missed this. The answer is yes, all motto banners are integral to the eagle plate.

Bruno

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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by aicusv » Thu Aug 02, 2018 10:53 am

Truly a beautiful helmet. Interesting in that he was a Fahnenjunker-Unteroffizier and it is an issued helmet. I wonder if he rented it figuring when he become an officer he would have to purchase another helmet?
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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by JzPf » Thu Aug 09, 2018 12:54 am

A beautiful helmet, congratulations!

Dennis

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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by 911car » Sun Sep 23, 2018 7:46 am

aicusv wrote:
Thu Aug 02, 2018 10:53 am
Truly a beautiful helmet. Interesting in that he was a Fahnenjunker-Unteroffizier and it is an issued helmet. I wonder if he rented it figuring when he become an officer he would have to purchase another helmet?
Good question. It is not rare to see enlisted type helmets named to non commissioned officers. Did they have to purchase their own helmet, as officers did? If they could not afford one, or kept it as an Extra-Helm, were they free to wear the basic trooper headgear? Who knows everything about helmet demographics in the Imperial army? Joe? Tony? Brian?..
I even have a Mecklenburg M15 named to an officer...

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Re: 1st of Hannover Dragoner Regiment #9

Post by pickelhauben » Sun Sep 23, 2018 9:17 am

As all have said a real beauty.

I would love to have this on my shelf.

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