Another rare Ersatz helmet

J.LeBrasseur

J.LeBrasseur

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Staff member
Ok Guy's looking for feedback. In all my years of collecting I have heard of this Ersatz type, but never owned one until now.



It appears to be a one piece design of felt or fiber that is lacquered heavily on the outside to the point it feels like plastic. Inside is black and feels like felt(fuzzy) So again one piece visors are part of the shell, stitching you see is holding on liner.



When you take the plate off, and I think I was the first to ever do it, there are 3 holes? the outside two fit the wappen, no idea why there is a center hole?



All furniture is heavily tarnished silver.



It is a very unique ersatz pattern.



Front visor has shrunk or shifted due to heat, so front trim needs to be shortened.



Ok give it to me straight, what do you think. This is another one I got from the Julia auction in my lot, that I did not know was this type until it showed up.



James

















 
VERY unique indeed! I would say that judging from the symmetry of the front visor and rear "neck guard" that the extra hole was for the vent (it could be assembled either way front or back, so to make it idiot proof, a hole in both front and back).
That's about my thoughts for the moment. Another to mull over. What interesting stuff you guys purchased!

:D Ron
 
Looks great James, a one piece felt helme with lacquered exterior to provide water proofing. A good score!
 
This must be one of the rarest ersatz helme I think... Congrats!
James, do you think the shell shrunk that much, so the helmetplate doesn't fit correctly anymore? I would think if this shell shrinks, there would be cracks all over it... Anyway, I certainly wouldn'y attempt to reshape things, it looks great just the way it is.
Sorry, I don't know (or think) more about the 3rd hole than already has been said...

Adler

PS Is it possible to take some pictures (side and front) of the complete helmet please?
 
I was just looking at the front visor trim as well. IF that were my helmet, I would not remove those rivets from the visor trim (they don't look like the normal type) and would just leave it as is. IF the space seemed to be problematic, maybe a thin black spacer or shim that is cut to rest in the trim and on the very edge of the visor would work to keep the visor from curling outward or deforming? However, I'd leave the front trim in place. IMHO. :)

:D Ron
 
I'm still looking at that third hole. I don't get it. A different Wappen? :-k Something used as a holding mechanism during production? :?: :dontknow: :wave:
 
poniatowski said:
I was just looking at the front visor trim as well. IF that were my helmet, I would not remove those rivets from the visor trim (they don't look like the normal type) and would just leave it as is. IF the space seemed to be problematic, maybe a thin black spacer or shim that is cut to rest in the trim and on the very edge of the visor would work to keep the visor from curling outward or deforming? However, I'd leave the front trim in place. IMHO. :)

:D Ron
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I agree. Beautiful helmet, don't touch a thing.
Steve
 
joerookery said:
I'm still looking at that third hole. I don't get it. A different Wappen? :-k Something used as a holding mechanism during production? :?: :dontknow: :wave:
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I'm going to agree with Joe. The hole is so round and seems perfectly centered that I think it could be something done in the production process. Great piece.
 
Peter_Suciu said:
joerookery said:
I'm still looking at that third hole. I don't get it. A different Wappen? :-k Something used as a holding mechanism during production? :?: :dontknow: :wave:
Click to expand...

I'm going to agree with Joe. The hole is so round and seems perfectly centered that I think it could be something done in the production process. Great piece.
Click to expand...

How high is the vent hole on the other side? Near the top I'd guess.... higher than the mid-wappen one on front.

:D Ron
 
edwin said:
That's indeed a rare helmet! Thanks for sharing Regards, Edwin
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Did you gentlemen read that James is now selling it on ebay without the eagle? So one has to assume James has possibly reached the same conclusion as I have when I saw this, that it is not even an original pickelhaube and not worth keeping. Which is why the plate was saved and its on ebay.
 
yup, I cam to the conclusion that it is not a real helmet IMO. Kept the wappen and sold helmet on Ebay for not much.

James
 
J.LeBrasseur said:
yup, I cam to the conclusion that it is not a real helmet IMO. Kept the wappen and sold helmet on Ebay for not much.

James
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That's too bad it panned out that way. I'd thought you'd captured a real find! So, maybe that single hole was for a badge of some sort that the helmet was manufactured for (band, fraternal group, etc). (???) OR maybe it was an outright fake. :-k

Ron
 
James, what made you decide it's a fake? In the pics it looks ok, besides it would be an unusual model, made in an unusaul way...

Adler
 
I am still up in the air on it, but a few things just did not sit right.

1) hole in front? Why?

2) Liner just did not feel right to me, not sure why, but just did not feel like it was German?

3) Nut on inside back spine, not normal nut?

4) side posts, one side put on in wrong position?

Again, could be a good piece, but I did not want to be trying to justify all the time if I kept it.

James
 
Ok, in my humble opinion J. man, I think you jumped the gun here.....that liner is good. Look how tight it is to the rim of the shell, the fold line is crisp, not puffy like a repro. It has been on there a long time. What was un German about it? The octagonal nut did exist at this time, it was not common but that one matches the threading on the screw post and tightens right down as it should., modern ones do not. This was a unique piece, it had unique characteristics. The M91's I have no picture to go by, but we are putting them on a lacquered felt one piece helmet....SO? If you have not sent it, take a pause and maybe send buddy his money back and take the flack.
 
b.loree said:
Ok, in my humble opinion J. man, I think you jumped the gun here.....that liner is good. Look how tight it is to the rim of the shell, the fold line is crisp, not puffy like a repro. It has been on there a long time. What was un German about it? The octagonal nut did exist at this time, it was not common but that one matches the threading on the screw post and tightens right down as it should., modern ones do not. This was a unique piece, it had unique characteristics. The M91's I have no picture to go by, but we are putting them on a lacquered felt one piece helmet....SO? If you have not sent it, take a pause and maybe send buddy his money back and take the flack.
Click to expand...

Speaking of 'out of place' or not correctly mounted parts on helmets, I also collect tanker helmets (having been a tanker) and I have a Rawlings WWII type (commonly called an "M-38") with the neck guard and ear flaps a full half inch off of the center mark on the rear of the helmet. It feels odd on the head, but was issued (not one that came from the stockpile in India in the 1980's).

I missed seeing this one Pick on ebay, but saw a different one without a plate.

:D Ron
 
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