JR 92 - has any one ever seen a wappen like this

garlanj

garlanj

Active member
Hi all
A German auction house has a rather beat up JR 92 haube for sale at the moment and just out of curiosity I asked for some more detailed pictures of the front and back of the wappen. Naturally there are 2 sets of holes in the shell, but has anyone ever seen the back of a wappen like this?
746 (2).JPG
746 (1).JPG
Sealing wax?
Cheers
Jeremy
 
No idea why those blobs of wax are there. But even the laziest fakers would not use wax. I’ve had a original Wappen where the nuts were missing, and someone had secured the overlay with hot glue.

Just a caution that the easiest way to make a fraudulent helmet Wappen for one of the Duchy Regiments is to take a relatively common original Prussian Reserve officer which has no Bandeau (you can see the FR on the back), and then mount an overlay to cover the FR. So it really you need to decide if the overlay (of any Regt.) is original. Very common to see this configuration with an fake IR92 Totenkopf mounted onto an original Prussian Reserve officer.
 
So, that shows my ignorance. If it's a duchy wappen, it shouldn't have the FR, no matter if its a reserve or if it has the fuerst bandeau? You live and learn.
I wasn't considering bidding but just found the wax on the back an inteesting alternative to super glue :)
Gentlemen, once again thank you for sharing your knowledge.
Cheers
Jeremy
(By the way Steve, STUNNING helmets, thanks for sharing)
 
Tony without Kaiser said:
No idea why those blobs of wax are there. But even the laziest fakers would not use wax. I’ve had a original Wappen where the nuts were missing, and someone had secured the overlay with hot glue.

Just a caution that the easiest way to make a fraudulent helmet Wappen for one of the Duchy Regiments is to take a relatively common original Prussian Reserve officer which has no Bandeau (you can see the FR on the back), and then mount an overlay to cover the FR. So it really you need to decide if the overlay (of any Regt.) is original. Very common to see this configuration with an fake IR92 Totenkopf mounted onto an original Prussian Reserve officer.
Click to expand...
I fully agree with Tony. However, remember that the Braunschweig army was fully integrated in the Prussian one from 1886 to 1897, and hence I am not surprised to see Braunschweig reserve helmets - especially earlier ones - with FR plates. This one below was found untouched in original box. The enamel is unfortunately damaged, but at least authenticity is doubtless.

I do not mean to defend the plate originally presented in this thread though!...

G1070731.JPGG1070727.JPGG1070724.JPG
 
Thanks Bruno
Once again, a lovely haube.
So from what's been said, both the overlay and the wappen could be genuine although what else is the sealing wax covering I wonder? I'm not, but just incase anyone is interested, here is the link on the Saleroom website Brunswick Pickelhaube . Oh and of course the Brunswick officers cockade is missing too 😂
Take care all
Jeremy
 
The reserve officer has a nail hole in the rear visor.
Perhaps it was a War Band helmet?
If so, it sure was a good one.
Steve
 
Gorgeous helmets, Steve. Our mutual acquaintance JA had a 92nd with red velvet eyes. I don’t think I’ve seen another like that. I think he also had a 92nd zahlmeister in all silver?

Dennis
 
JzPf said:
Gorgeous helmets, Steve. Our mutual acquaintance JA had a 92nd with red velvet eyes. I don’t think I’ve seen another like that. I think he also had a 92nd zahlmeister in all silver?

Dennis
Click to expand...
Dennis
I know the silver Zahlmeister I R 92 helmet well .I was able to trade for it back then .I had it for a number of years .
IMO it was 100 % I think that Weitze turned it up .From there it to the Der R . JA bought it from Der R before Der R
cut him off. A few years ago I sold / traded it to another collector .It was time to let it go .Here is a photo from 2007.
As to the red behind the eyes I guess that any owner collector or officer could place the red behind the eyes .It was not official I R 92 Z.jpg
Steve
 
Well, the original wappen might have been questionable but the topic has brought out some fantastic helmets. Thanks all for sharing your wonderful examples.
All the best
Jeremy
 
First, Jeremy thank you for asking the question about this type wappen; Tony, Steve and Bruno I appreciate your sharing your experience, information and pictures.
Best regards
John
 
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