New scroll helmet picture

R

Robert

New member
This is a GMGA again, 238 this time. It is stamped and dated January 11th, 1916.

I have been wondering what the little dark spot on the side of the plate is. Its not a speckle. The man is very lightly twisted, so it is not totally clear whether the plate is off center and reveals an old hole for a line eagle.


gmga238_1k.jpg


gmga238_2k.jpg


gmga238_3k.jpg
 
Robert said:
I have been wondering what the little dark spot on the side of the plate is. Its not a speckle.
Click to expand...

That would be a hole for a Wappen loop. I am convinced that these felt shells were made by manufacturers and shipped out by the crates, and often ended up being used for units like this. if you are every lucky enough to examine a Filz ersatz helmet with a cruciform spike base, look inside and you will almost certainly see four unused holes made by the manufacturer for a round spike base.

I love photos with dogs. Oh, nice helmet too Robert. :compress:
 
I agree with Tony -- production made holes. The way I understand the production to have worked the manufacturer delivered ex number of helmets with specific specifications. Based on the timing of these units many filz helmets would still be in the "pipeline" and could be diverted to these units. What I do not know is exactly how they were attached. Need to find an example of play with. This picture though far less good than yours demonstrates his same hole.
march_5.jpg


Nice picture! Extremely nice picture.
 
Joe, I knew that John Kerry claimed to be a hero of the Viet Nam conflict but didn't realize that he fought for the Germans in the Balkans. This photograph is proof of the latter.
 
I guess the GMGA helmets would have been made in Bavaria, so the holes would not be for a line eagle as I first thought buth rather for a Bavarian plate which requires wider holes anyway (If I rememeber correctly).

The fact that we know only a few pictures of felt helmet and two of them show the left hole might indicate a pattern. Perhaps the loop holes interfered with the attachment of the scroll plate (split brads perhaps) so they always placed them a bit off-center to the right if holes were already present. Oh well, who knows.
 
Robert,

What makes you think Bavarian manufacture? Is it recruiting areas? I know that 250 came from Wurrtemberg.

One of the things I have noticed is that your new 238 picture has a different subtype scroll than your 247 picture. While both of them would be characterized as type 1 in the article -- the 238 picture you sent me seems to have a design on each edge of the tab. Am I seeing things or do you notice the same anomaly? -- Man do you find some nice pictures!
 
The plate does look less shiny. A pattern? Difficult to tell,

What makes you think Bavarian manufacture? Is it recruiting areas
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I took this idea from the stamp (BAYER.JRE DIV.) but the adress is hard to read I can´t tell the town. I will try to decipher this or can you?


gmga238_adresse.jpg
 
:eek: The mystery deepens!

I not only can not make out the town -- I cannot entirely make out the divisional stamp. There were only two Bavarian divisions that are candidate's. The 11th Bavarian division and the AlpenKorps division. Is this the 11th?

But wait there's more -- I thought -- thought --that the Gebirgs Maschinengewehr Abteilung were non-divisional organizations. I have been unable to get a good order of battle with these units in it. If it is a corps unit why is it using a divisional post office?
 
His own address (upside down beside the staps) does tell "11. Bayer. infdiv." Maybe that does not resemble a fixed assignment to the division but rather an organizational relation for recruitment. The picture was probably taken in Germany, so they were still in training and maybe used the facilities of the 11. division.

The city of the receivers address might be Liebenwerda, allthough this is Brandenburg its right at the Bavarian border.

One book that I have from the "Reichsarchive" series lists the units that were still present in Macedonia at the end of the war. The GMGA are listed as follows: "210, 211... 248 (Bayer.), 250 (Württ.)" which seems to indicate that the numbers below 250 were Bavarian? But 238 is not listed explicitely. BTW, this book also lists an Ersatz GMGA with the number 3.
 
That is a very cool foto Robert! These filz helme with scroll were always an unknown quantity when I started collecting. I encountered a 22 I believe a long time ago but I am certain it was faked. These pictures and the info that you, Joe and others have shared is invaluable. Brian
 
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