Trichter questions....

W

weirdpyramid

New member
Hello all

I am looking for information about parade trichter base screws. I am interested in buying a Hessen trichter, that i believe is original but my question is how likely is it going to fit the spike base of a helmet? I have read that the screw posts on trichters came in different diameters, how common is this? How did they deal with this 100 years ago? Would a prussian trichter screw base fit in a hessen style spike base and vice versa? I cant really find much info on this subject so I am asking all of you for some real life experiences with trichters.


Was there a regulation diameter of the trichter opening? if not, i guess this could be the result....
 
Would a prussian trichter screw base fit in a hessen style spike base and vice versa?
Click to expand...

I have only limited experience with this but what I have really backs up the screw diameter issue. It was not a matter of Prussian or Hessian it was a matter of which retailer you got the helmet from. Catalogs are full of warnings that say basically if you did not buy it here we cannot guarantee that the addition will fit. Tony Cowan once told me he had found almost 10 different diameters between top and bottom.

The last one I bought fit like a glove to the helmet I was matching it to.
 
Yep. Its the screw post. same problem for a Haube missing a spike top, Kugel top, etc. it will either fit (a miracle), be too loose and flop around, or not screw in at all.
 
I'll just add my two cents. This isn't limited to German helmets from that era either. As an international collector I see this all time with British and American helmets, with spikes and ventilator caps.

Fortunately with the Americans there were only two major suppliers of the horsehair plume and white helmets.

Makes me wonder how many soldiers bought replacement parts and had to deal with these issues of parts not fitting together.
 
This looks like a Hessian point screwed onto a round base:
http://cgi.ebay.com/MILITARY-WAR-HELMET-SPIKE-/250797028508?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a64aaf49c
 
Thanks for the help guys! so i understand that the screw post come in all different diameters but what about the opening diameter of the trichter versus the diameter of the spike base? Its just a theory of mine because i dont have enough helmets in my collection to really compare but wouldnt there be a variety of spike base diameters also? or was the spike base diameter pretty universal in size? I have tried to explain this question with my little diagram up top.
 
In my experience, the spike base is pretty universal in diameter. Most officer bases are raised and have a cut out for the rear spine. The OR spike base fits flat to the shell top. and the OR spine usually has a thin piece of brass on the end that is designed to slip under the base. Sometimes this end piece is elongated and has a hole so that the rear split brad for the base goes down through the hole and effectively anchors the spine to the spike base.
Spikes come in 2 styles OR's and Officer's. Within these 2 styles, there are spikes made for trichter wearing regiments and those without trichter. Any officer or OR spike for a trichter regiment, has 4 parts: the base, spike neck, threaded neck cap and screw on spike top. The neck cap is threaded but there is also a steel nut (usually 6 sided or square) soldered to the underside of the cap. So when the spike or kugel is screwed down it is being screwed both into the neck cap and the square nut. The threading in the neck cap and the spike screw are not universal, it all depends on the manufacturer so they are not interchangeable. For example you could spend $200 on an officer spike top which does not fit your officer base. The design of the neck cap can also vary between manufacturers. There are also custom OR's spikes built with an officer style base but no pearl ring. The spike top on these can also be slimmer and higher ie. more fashionable.
The non trichter spike top only has 3 parts, there is no need for the neck cap and thus the top is simply soldered to the spike neck.

The fluted spike top on Bavarian officer helmets has a lip which goes over the top of the spike neck when screwed down. A Prussian Generals' spike top is also fluted but fits down flush with the neck top. I was told this by Randy T as a way of making certain that your Prussian Generals helme was legitimate. The only Generals' helmet that I owned (Pruss) did have this type of spike and that was one characteristic of the helmet that insured that it was a generals. In my obsession with "haube parts" I have accumulated several officer spike bases without spikes. I will post some pics of these later to illustrate this post. Any other members with comments or corrections please post.
 
Gents, since we're discussing Trichters I would like to know if the Prussian Beamte Off. Pickelhaube (M1897) was entitled for a paradebush?
 
RON said:
Gents, since we're discussing Trichters I would like to know if the Prussian Beamte Off. Pickelhaube (M1897) was entitled for a paradebush?
Click to expand...

I believe not RON. I have gone through many books and found no evidence of a parade bush.
 
my question still remains though about "trichter regulations" if there were any, especially with the FAR 25th. I have gone into a little detail about it in my post a couple responses down...

http://www.pickelhaubes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5980

it seems from book references and photos that not always was a Hessen style trichter worn for the FAR 25th. possibly I am really "reaching" with this topic but maybe there is something to it.

parade25.jpg

parade26.jpg

25th.jpg

paradec.jpg
 
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