2nd Kuirassier Regiment Enlisted Helmet
- Thread starter skelts1974
- Start date
Khukri
Well-known member
On our book cover picture:
(Translation from Dragoner Regiment Nr 17 Regimental History):
“Painting by G. von Boddien; father of a fallen comrade who rode in this charge as a Fähnrich : showing the second charge of the Halen Fight. Ridden by the 1st Eskadron (Leibeskadron) Groβ-Herzoglich Mecklenburgischen Dragoner Regiment Nr 17 (Ludwigslust)- Halen-12 August 1914. Rittmeister Erhard Graf von Kalnein is leading, his sword drawn. Next to him the Cheftrompeter is on the ground. Others had tumbled before and try to get up again. The Rittmeister will get killed only seconds later. The situation is correctly shown. One can see how-as in a hunt-frontaly and from the flank-standing riflemen down the game”
The oilpainting was painted (in Dresden)- after the testimony and drawings by survivors of the charge. The painting was kept by the von Bodecker family since 1945. (Salvaged from the Regimental Officers Mess). Professor von Bodecker-one of the sons-inheritted the painting from his mother. It was handed over to the Stroobants family, owners of the Museum “Slag der Zilveren Helmen” on April 22nd 2009.
(Translation from Dragoner Regiment Nr 17 Regimental History):
“Painting by G. von Boddien; father of a fallen comrade who rode in this charge as a Fähnrich : showing the second charge of the Halen Fight. Ridden by the 1st Eskadron (Leibeskadron) Groβ-Herzoglich Mecklenburgischen Dragoner Regiment Nr 17 (Ludwigslust)- Halen-12 August 1914. Rittmeister Erhard Graf von Kalnein is leading, his sword drawn. Next to him the Cheftrompeter is on the ground. Others had tumbled before and try to get up again. The Rittmeister will get killed only seconds later. The situation is correctly shown. One can see how-as in a hunt-frontaly and from the flank-standing riflemen down the game”
The oilpainting was painted (in Dresden)- after the testimony and drawings by survivors of the charge. The painting was kept by the von Bodecker family since 1945. (Salvaged from the Regimental Officers Mess). Professor von Bodecker-one of the sons-inheritted the painting from his mother. It was handed over to the Stroobants family, owners of the Museum “Slag der Zilveren Helmen” on April 22nd 2009.
Khukri
Well-known member
Yesterday 20th June we were in Halen:
We presented our book to Julien Stroobants, the owner of the Battlefieldmuseum and took the book to the Battlefield.
Standing at the European cross of remembrance, in the centre of the battlefield. Belgian Artillery was positioned at the hillcrest at the horizon: The guns were the main objective for the German Eskadrons. The IJzerwinning Farm was in the centre of the battlefield where the Belgian Main Defense Line stretched out, manned by dismounted Belgian Lancers.
at about 300 meters In front of the MDL stood the Belgian Cyclist troops; in the open field; unprotected. They had to deal with the successive charges by the German Eskadrons.
We presented our book to Julien Stroobants, the owner of the Battlefieldmuseum and took the book to the Battlefield.
Standing at the European cross of remembrance, in the centre of the battlefield. Belgian Artillery was positioned at the hillcrest at the horizon: The guns were the main objective for the German Eskadrons. The IJzerwinning Farm was in the centre of the battlefield where the Belgian Main Defense Line stretched out, manned by dismounted Belgian Lancers.
at about 300 meters In front of the MDL stood the Belgian Cyclist troops; in the open field; unprotected. They had to deal with the successive charges by the German Eskadrons.
joerookery
Well-known member
This review is from: The Last Great Cavalry Charge-The Battle of the Silver Helmets-Halen-12 August 1914 (Hardcover)
RIDERS OF THE STORM
Joe Robinson, Francis Hendricks and Janet Robinson,
The Battle of the Silver Helmets Halen 12th August 1914. Fonthill, £18.99. Hardback, 160 pages, 37 ills. maps, notes and refs, bibliog. ISBN 978-1-78155-183-7.
As they proved in their magnificent reference work The Great War Dawning, published last year, American ex-soldiers Joe and Janet Robinson certainly know about the German Army of 1914. In The Last Great Cavalry Charge their expertise has been boosted by the contribution of former Belgian soldier and military historian Francis Hendricks. The result is fascinating. An account of a battle which took place days before the BEF went into the line at Mons and one which I venture few readers of Stand To! have even heard.
Whilst my own research on First Ypres had shown the lack of training of German cavalry in dismounted action, the authors truly underline incompetence of the nation’s mounted arm. It had prepared for past wars. Despite Terence Zuber’s views which loudly happily trumpet the magnificent quality of every almost aspect of the German army in 1914, its cavalry was inadequate. It was an arm of service still shackled to the anachronistic concept of the "knee to knee" grand action charge, of night-time bivouac. Deployed in inadequate strength, on the left of the advance into Belgium, it offered dated Napoleonic personnel sapping, horse killing, and exhibition of military inefficiency. I In truth it was little more than a parade ground trophy force whose problems of outmoded doctrine were magnified by strategic and tactical ineptitude and defective logistical support. Unlike British cavalry - trained and highly effective infantry once dismounted – the German was effective in the 20th century as would have been Ney’s (whose thinking it broadly, and it seems willingly, embraced).
If not the very last cavalry charge, the fighting at Halen was almost certainly the most disastrous employment of cavalry on the field of battle of the Great War. Two brigades of Fourth Cavalry Division attempted no less than seven separate charges. In effect they were destroyed by dismounted Belgian cavalry and infantry which was itself firmly on the on the back foot. The episode underlined in stark terms that the Germans had ignored a new reality - modern weaponry made the élan of l’arme Blanche dead in its saddle. The tides of war had washed over the sand of mounted man and horse. Those on foot, with magazine rifles and the support of relatively limited quick firing artillery and machine guns now held all the aces against lance wielding men on horses and the officers who commanded them.
The Last Great Cavalry Charge is not merely the story of the battle but also a valuable dissection of the German cavalry arm in 1914. In doing so it deploys an impressive range of official records, supported by telling personal Belgian and French personal accounts 37 well chosen illustrations. That all said it must be added that a number of niggles indicate that the authors deserved better copy editing from their publisher. Mapping of the individual sections is adequate if necessarily broad brush. A large per map showing overall deployment and movement of forces and this area of Belgium, little know to Brits, would have been welcome. That all said this is a valuable addition to the early history of the Great War and a reflection of genuine ‘donkeyism’.
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RIDERS OF THE STORM
Joe Robinson, Francis Hendricks and Janet Robinson,
The Battle of the Silver Helmets Halen 12th August 1914. Fonthill, £18.99. Hardback, 160 pages, 37 ills. maps, notes and refs, bibliog. ISBN 978-1-78155-183-7.
As they proved in their magnificent reference work The Great War Dawning, published last year, American ex-soldiers Joe and Janet Robinson certainly know about the German Army of 1914. In The Last Great Cavalry Charge their expertise has been boosted by the contribution of former Belgian soldier and military historian Francis Hendricks. The result is fascinating. An account of a battle which took place days before the BEF went into the line at Mons and one which I venture few readers of Stand To! have even heard.
Whilst my own research on First Ypres had shown the lack of training of German cavalry in dismounted action, the authors truly underline incompetence of the nation’s mounted arm. It had prepared for past wars. Despite Terence Zuber’s views which loudly happily trumpet the magnificent quality of every almost aspect of the German army in 1914, its cavalry was inadequate. It was an arm of service still shackled to the anachronistic concept of the "knee to knee" grand action charge, of night-time bivouac. Deployed in inadequate strength, on the left of the advance into Belgium, it offered dated Napoleonic personnel sapping, horse killing, and exhibition of military inefficiency. I In truth it was little more than a parade ground trophy force whose problems of outmoded doctrine were magnified by strategic and tactical ineptitude and defective logistical support. Unlike British cavalry - trained and highly effective infantry once dismounted – the German was effective in the 20th century as would have been Ney’s (whose thinking it broadly, and it seems willingly, embraced).
If not the very last cavalry charge, the fighting at Halen was almost certainly the most disastrous employment of cavalry on the field of battle of the Great War. Two brigades of Fourth Cavalry Division attempted no less than seven separate charges. In effect they were destroyed by dismounted Belgian cavalry and infantry which was itself firmly on the on the back foot. The episode underlined in stark terms that the Germans had ignored a new reality - modern weaponry made the élan of l’arme Blanche dead in its saddle. The tides of war had washed over the sand of mounted man and horse. Those on foot, with magazine rifles and the support of relatively limited quick firing artillery and machine guns now held all the aces against lance wielding men on horses and the officers who commanded them.
The Last Great Cavalry Charge is not merely the story of the battle but also a valuable dissection of the German cavalry arm in 1914. In doing so it deploys an impressive range of official records, supported by telling personal Belgian and French personal accounts 37 well chosen illustrations. That all said it must be added that a number of niggles indicate that the authors deserved better copy editing from their publisher. Mapping of the individual sections is adequate if necessarily broad brush. A large per map showing overall deployment and movement of forces and this area of Belgium, little know to Brits, would have been welcome. That all said this is a valuable addition to the early history of the Great War and a reflection of genuine ‘donkeyism’.
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Kriegsbeute
New member
as you said the Leather-Liner was missing..but the "Kokarden" are brand-New...there are exsisting better Copies off..
and there are some Indications "first Look" for me that the Eagle with "Devisenband" also is being a Copie...need more Pictures of the Eagle..but...this is only my private opinion to this Helmet.. another things also don't compares...themes like a 1867 or 1880 style Helment, exeption the round Frontvisor and the "Schlagschutz-Sicke" in the back of the Helmet.. this combination doesent Match, exeption
only for Sachsen-Gardereiter-Helmets Manschafften !!!!!!
P.s. as longer as watch this Helmet..as more I see no matching parts, this is a composition ..but not a real good Kürassier Helmet....
my opinon..sorry if you like I can Post some pictures for you to see where are the differences....
Gruß
Kriegsbeute
and there are some Indications "first Look" for me that the Eagle with "Devisenband" also is being a Copie...need more Pictures of the Eagle..but...this is only my private opinion to this Helmet.. another things also don't compares...themes like a 1867 or 1880 style Helment, exeption the round Frontvisor and the "Schlagschutz-Sicke" in the back of the Helmet.. this combination doesent Match, exeption
only for Sachsen-Gardereiter-Helmets Manschafften !!!!!!
P.s. as longer as watch this Helmet..as more I see no matching parts, this is a composition ..but not a real good Kürassier Helmet....
my opinon..sorry if you like I can Post some pictures for you to see where are the differences....
Gruß
Kriegsbeute
joerookery
Well-known member
.
I would like to see the pictures please.
Kriegsbeute
New member
here they are...1867 Kürassier Helmet with "Säbel-Schlagschutz" in the back and "geschweiftem " Frontvisor.. 100% original, as well as a Saxony Garde-Reiter Helmet and a Line-Kürassier-Offz.-Helmet...take a closer look and yu will understand my doubt's against the Helmet fom the threadstarter....
I'm try to be honest, belive me.....and these Helmets are Original...No Faked ones !!!!
Gruß
Kriegsbeute
I'm try to be honest, belive me.....and these Helmets are Original...No Faked ones !!!!
Gruß
Kriegsbeute
Kriegsbeute
New member
Kriegsbeute said:
joerookery
Well-known member
I guess I just don't understand. This was redone by a restorer.
skelts1974
New member
I am really not sure what this bloke is talking about. The kokardes are a copy. No problem there. The chin scales are original from Weitze. The liner is a replacement. The shell is an original private purchase (check out Tony's Kaiser bunker for a description of private purchase helmets similar to this).
The wappen is original to the helmet. I discussed this with Age of Kings when I brought it. I wouldn't have brought it otherwise. It has been heavily repaired, polished and repainted. The sceptre is a replacement - so does not quite match. This is clearly seen by looking at the photos.
Sigh, there is just no explaining to some people!
The wappen is original to the helmet. I discussed this with Age of Kings when I brought it. I wouldn't have brought it otherwise. It has been heavily repaired, polished and repainted. The sceptre is a replacement - so does not quite match. This is clearly seen by looking at the photos.
Sigh, there is just no explaining to some people!
I think he is saying that the reinforcing spine on the back of the dome is incorrect for a helmet with a rounded, non-stepped visor. This is true for "issue" helmets, but not for private purchase helmets, as you say. Furthermore, I wouldn't be surprised if older shells were updated with rounded visors...
skelts1974
New member
Nice, my copy arrived a week or two agog but I have yet to delve into it.
By the way I recently tracked down a set of original kokardes which now adorn this helmet.
By the way I recently tracked down a set of original kokardes which now adorn this helmet.