Another day, another not-often-seen Überzug

drakegoodman

drakegoodman

New member
Gentlemen,

Actually, the Überzug looks stock standard, it's the letters / number that caught my eye. Do the two dots on either side of the "I" have any significance ie: tactical / organizational symbol for a machinegun company or is that just wishful thinking?

Details of the wearer I've managed to glean from Kriegsranglisten und -stammrollen des Königreichs Bayern, 1. Weltkrieg 1914-1918:

Lothar Scheuer, Infanterie, 3 Ersatz-Masch. Gewehr-Kompanie Standort Hammelburg. This corresponds with the information he provided on the back of the postcard, so we have the right man.


E by drakegoodman, on Flickr


Lothar Scheuer, Maschinengewehr-Einheiten, 1 Ersatz-Masch. Gewehr.-Kompanie Standort München by drakegoodman, on Flickr
 
I get what you're saying, hell if I squint I can even see the 4 you're talking about, but I just believe that the E is so sharp, then why would the alleged 4 be just a line and two dots? Also, is it just coincidence that this fellow is a machinegunner and the/a German tactical symbol for a (light) machinegun unit is a line flanked by two dots? Furthermore, I've reviewed his Militär-Dienstzeitbescheinigung and it looks like he never served in any formation "4".
 
Brett,

You know of major postcard envy so I grudgingly have to say congratulations! Not seen that before. I think we have two reasonable arguments here. And I will side with you Brett-LMG-. here is my reasoning. It just seems too clear to me to be a four. Actually, not a bad interpretation but I do not buy it primarily because of the number. If it was a one or a two it might be more convincing but a four? How would that work into ersatz Battalion? I have never seen this before and there are always new discoveries. This is a good one!

Is there a date on the card? One thing that gives me pause is the entire concept of light. Certainly is a good one.
 
joerookery said:
Brett,

You know of major postcard envy so I grudgingly have to say congratulations! Not seen that before. I think we have two reasonable arguments here. And I will side with you Brett-LMG-. here is my reasoning. It just seems too clear to me to be a four. Actually, not a bad interpretation but I do not buy it primarily because of the number. If it was a one or a two it might be more convincing but a four? How would that work into ersatz Battalion? I have never seen this before and there are always new discoveries. This is a good one!

Is there a date on the card? One thing that gives me pause is the entire concept of light. Certainly is a good one.
Click to expand...

G'day Joe,

Thanks for taking a look at this for me and sorry about the postcard envy, I've been living with it for years and know it will soon pass.

The date on the back of the card is 21.12.1914 which marries up with the information in this fellow's service records; he was serving with 3 Ersatz-Masch. Gewehr-Kompanie (II BAK) in Hammelburg at this time.

I have been trying to source a list of the tactical symbols used by the Germans in WW1 to support my theory, but the only one I could locate is a list from WW2, and this is where the "LMG" originates. I'm hoping that the WW1 version drops the L and will just have MG.

Thanks again.

B.
 
Well for a pint of your best I might be able to help you out with this…

So it seems as though everything you dreamed of is true. It's just machine-gun company. This comes from the red donkey of 1914. I only know of two copies in existence.- I would bet that even Glenn does not have one! Wager?


red donkey 125 by joerookery, on Flickr
 
Joe,

Is that the "Anhaltspunkte für den Generalstabsdienst"?

No, I do not have a copy but have examined a copy at the ZMSBw in Potsdam.

Glenn
 
Is that the "Anhaltspunkte für den Generalstabsdienst"?
Click to expand...

Yes precisely! So now I know of three copies. To actually have something that Glenn does not have! You have shared so much with us if they are is part of that I can share with you I would be glad to. To the best of my knowledge nothing from this is ever been published in the English language. They were apparently issued in annual usage and we used it a lot to especially show what was not in there. For instance the HKK was not part of the planning process. Fascinating little study.

VR
Joe
 
=D> Well done and many thanks Joe. Simply brilliant! Pints are a British thing, you'll have to settle for a "pot" of our finest.
 
Okay gun guy – maybe one of you guys can solve this one. My understanding is that the cavalry carbine used in 1914 did not have a bayonet mounting bracket. Therefore, no way to use a bayonet with that weapon. True or false?
 
drakegoodman said:
I get what you're saying, hell if I squint I can even see the 4 you're talking about, but I just believe that the E is so sharp, then why would the alleged 4 be just a line and two dots? Also, is it just coincidence that this fellow is a machinegunner and the/a German tactical symbol for a (light) machinegun unit is a line flanked by two dots? Furthermore, I've reviewed his Militär-Dienstzeitbescheinigung and it looks like he never served in any formation "4".
Click to expand...

Have you examined the image under extreme magnification? If it is clearly two dots as you say, then you must be correct, it is not a 4. Very strange. Tactical markings on a cover are not discussed in any reference I am aware of.
 
I vote LMG.
I'm not surprised that new discoveries continue to surface, such as this one...

 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top