Garde Offizier Haube without stars??????

argonne

argonne

Well-known member
Hi all!
Look at this one:
http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=150431874150&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT
Offizier wappen and Offizier Kokarden too. But why without Offizier stars?? :o Maybe one year volunteer, but then would be the cockades not correct.... :cry:
Does anyone have an idea?
Philippe :salute:
 
Thank you for this explanation, Tony and M-max! :)
Further, what is the difference between Fähnrich and Offizierstellvertreter?
Ok, a Fähnrich is a "wannabe Offizier", maybe like "Offiziersanwärter" (is waiting to be ein Offizier). What is the difference between the helmets pattern for those two ranks? Does someone have pictures to compare? If I´m not wrong, the comparison would only be possible for the time after 1914. (because the rank of Offizierstellvertreter did´nt really exist before, only "on paper", in the 1888 Wehrordnung).

Philippe :salute:
 
Fähnrich is officer candidate. A Fähnrich is a soldier who serves in the ranks, first as a junior non-commissioned officer then in subsequent grades equivalent to Unterfeldwebel (until 1945, now Unteroffizier), Feldwebel, and Oberfeldwebel (until 1945, now Hauptfeldwebel). The end goal is to create an officer out of the Fähnrich. Offizier Stellvertreter is like a deputy officer (OStv) is one of the higher grade NCOs or staff sergeants.
 
I am late to this party but that was an interesting helmet. I thought it was in less than perfect shape which would affect its value significantly. This is the second, that I have seen that comes from the guard Corps as a private purchase but still has an enlisted type spike base.

Ok, a Fähnrich is a "wannabe Offizier", maybe like "Offiziersanwärter" (is waiting to be ein Offizier). What is the difference between the helmets pattern for those two ranks? Does someone have pictures to compare? If I´m not wrong, the comparison would only be possible for the time after 1914. (because the rank of Offizierstellvertreter did´nt really exist before, only "on paper", in the 1888 Wehrordnung).
Click to expand...

Fähnrich is a step in the commissioning process. There are several types of these guys and though this is self-serving I would recommend you look at the explanations of commissioning in the Handbook.

Offizierstellvertreter Has yet to be fully understood in my opinion. It did not exist in reality until 1914 however then there were a lot of them. There seems to have been confusion as to what they could do or could not do. as a result, I do not think there is a clear pattern of helmet for these guys. I have one that came in the chest marked clearly to an Offizierstellvertreter and the helmet is all active officer.
 
What would an Ulan Tschapka look like for a Fähnrich?
Click to expand...

Fair question! My vote would be for some sort of combination of officer and enlisted traits most likely in a private purchase helmet. You really start to stumble when you look at the cockade and the field badge. there seems to be very strong evidence in my humble opinion that people upgraded those items to officer when they earned their sword knot. however, I think there are photographs that indicate that this practice was used by some relative beginners. :hiding: :hiding:
 
That sounds logical.

Page 520 of The German Cavalry 1871-1914 shows a Wurttemburg U.R. 20 Tschapka with features of both EM and officer helmets.
The plate also bears a reserve cross. The caption notes that it was for use "on leave" and it "has all the features, apart from the front plate, that a Senior NCO could wear." The field badge is black twisted cord with a red center. The cockade is not shown very clearly, but may have a silver ring.
 
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