Hussaren Busby Question

No doubt regarding the authenticity of the busby. The wicker frame is exactly as it should be, and the green colour of the lower liner is correct for a M15. What surprised me is the perfect aspect of the fur, as compared with the worn condition of the liner. In addition, or in fact principally, I have never, ever seen a M15 busby covered with bearskin (which is common on Eigentum and non-commissioned officer busbies, and enlisted HR17 busbies). With no exception, in my experience, M15 models are always covered with flat, shiny, straight-haired sealskin, and it is very rare to see one without at least some hair losses. Hence the suspicion that fur has been changed on this one. This is okay for some, but a no-no for me.
If I am wrong and M15 busbies also came in bearskin, I will be happy to learn.
 
KAGGR#1 said:
I was lucky to be able to buy my example not too long ago.
It came out of a very old Calif. collection that dates back to the 1950's
Years ago, when I first started to collect I had a M1915, but I sold it .
It took me many years to find a replacement
Here are some photos of my example
The fur can be in excellent condition if it has been cared for
My fur is in excellent condition
One photo of the inside is NOT the M1915, but I posted it to show the inside
It is an earlier model
I will look up what I paid for it and let you know
SteveView attachment 59592View attachment 59593View attachment 59594View attachment 59595View attachment 59596
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This is indeed exactly what a M15 busby should look like.
 
911car said:
What surprised me is the perfect aspect of the fur, as compared with the worn condition of the liner. In addition, or in fact principally, I have never, ever seen a M15 busby covered with bearskin (which is common on Eigentum and non-commissioned officer busbies, and enlisted HR17 busbies). With no exception, in my experience, M15 models are always covered with flat, shiny, straight-haired sealskin, and it is very rare to see one without at least some hair losses. Hence the suspicion that fur has been changed on this one. This is okay for some, but a no-no for me.
If I am wrong and M15 busbies also came in bearskin, I will be happy to learn.
Click to expand...

I 100% agree - I've seen many bear fur privately purchased pieces, but zero M15 ones (only seal fur or ersatz materials). Also it may be a trick of the light, but it appears there is a join seam just forward of the national kokarde, and maybe in a few other spots where it looks like the fur was pieced together, which would support the fur-restoration theory.
 
911car said:
No doubt regarding the authenticity of the busby. The wicker frame is exactly as it should be, and the green colour of the lower liner is correct for a M15. What surprised me is the perfect aspect of the fur, as compared with the worn condition of the liner. In addition, or in fact principally, I have never, ever seen a M15 busby covered with bearskin (which is common on Eigentum and non-commissioned officer busbies, and enlisted HR17 busbies). With no exception, in my experience, M15 models are always covered with flat, shiny, straight-haired sealskin, and it is very rare to see one without at least some hair losses. Hence the suspicion that fur has been changed on this one. This is okay for some, but a no-no for me.
If I am wrong and M15 busbies also came in bearskin, I will be happy to learn.
Click to expand...
I don't think so , that I know of
Steve
 
MAP said:
Gents,

Looking for some help here. I know nothing about these but have been wanting one for a while. I always planned on studying them to learn what to look for before I purchase one, but....then this popped up for sale on another forum.

As such, I'm asking for some advice/feedback. Anything good here. I'm just looking for basic example but one that is in very good condition.

Price is under Euro 2k.

Thanks in advance.

View attachment 59505View attachment 59506View attachment 59507View attachment 59508View attachment 59509View attachment 59510View attachment 59511
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If value helps you any
I paid $ 2,700 U S Dollars for my example and
I am very pleased to have it
I felt the price was O K for me
Steve
 
Thanks all. Long day driving and just got back a few minutes ago so enjoying another cigar to mellow out the NYC traffic aggression in my body LoL

Anyway, I've emailed the seller asking for a lot of things and photos i know little about. So hopefully he's willing to provide them and also answer my many questions.

Will keep you all updated. Fingers crossed.
 
KAGGR#1 said:
I was lucky to be able to buy my example not too long ago.
It came out of a very old Calif. collection that dates back to the 1950's
Years ago, when I first started to collect I had a M1915, but I sold it .
It took me many years to find a replacement
Here are some photos of my example
The fur can be in excellent condition if it has been cared for
My fur is in excellent condition
One photo of the inside is NOT the M1915, but I posted it to show the inside
It is an earlier model
I will look up what I paid for it and let you know
SteveView attachment 59592View attachment 59593View attachment 59594View attachment 59595View attachment 59596
Click to expand...

Thanks for showing. Beautiful example
 
Ok...I got some more photos. The back story is this was purchased from Ratisbons many years ago. The seller is also a forum sponsor (aka dealer) in WAF.

Not sure if the direction of the fur is the right way. But to my novice eyes it Busby looks ok to me. Of course happy to be completely wrong which is what learning is about.

His link is attached below.

Photos still aren't the best but hope they do. Doesn't look like there are unit marks on it and I do suspect this stampings are theater stamps.

German hussaren busby: German Headgear - Militaria Story

militariastory.com militariastory.com

image10.jpegimage9-1.jpegimage8.jpegimage7-1.jpegimage6-1.jpegimage5.jpegimage4.jpegimage3.jpegimage2.jpegimage1.jpegimage0.jpeg
 
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So any remailing concerns/issues/questions on the Busby Im looking to potentially purchase?

Or is it all good?

The blacked out stamps, while hard to see I. The photos look more like a maker stamp and not theater stamps but only an in hand inspection will tell (if I can read through the black out). Either way, that's not a concern for me. Just that it is an in.messed with original.

Thanks for all the help so far

M
 
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MAP said:
So any remailing concerns/issues/questions on the Busby Im looking to potentially purchase?

Or is it all good?

The blacked out stamps, while hard to see I. The photos look more like a maker stamp and not theater stamps but only an in hand inspection will tell (if I can read through the black out). Either way, that's not a concern for me. Just that it is an in.messed with original.

Thanks for all the help so far

M
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It seems that the question remains
Has it been re-furred ?
Steve
 
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Thanks Steve. And I would guess that it's not visible from these photos? If I need to ask for more, what should I be asking for? Or would only an in hand inspection tell?

I'm happy to walk away if need be. But of course would like to add it as I rarely see them for sale

Thanks

M
 
MAP said:
Thanks Steve. And I would guess that it's not visible from these photos? If I need to ask for more, what should I be asking for? Or would only an in hand inspection tell?

I'm happy to walk away if need be. But of course would like to add it as I rarely see them for sale

Thanks

M
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I think that it needs to be seen in person
and make sure that it can be returned if not pleased with it
Steve
 
Thanks Steve

I will speak to the seller. Ask him direct questions about the possibility of the fur being replaced and ask for a return gty. Let's see what he says.

As noted, I'm happy to walk away

Any more feedback from other members is appreciated
 
MAP said:
Thanks Steve

I will speak to the seller. Ask him direct questions about the possibility of the fur being replaced and ask for a return gty. Let's see what he says.

As noted, I'm happy to walk away

Any more feedback from other members is appreciated
Click to expand...
Could you ask the seller to remove the Kolpak from the "lid" and provide real good pictures of the lid and the top circle where the fur is bent inward and held by the leather brim. This could give us an idea on the fur question.
-the three part Kolpak: the round top part (#1) is held in place by a magnetic metal ring (#3); sewn in #1. (Galvanised, magnetic, sometimes stamped: Regimental mark; date; size of the metal ring...). Three metal hooks hold this part of the Kolpak in place. #2 is the bag; at the left of the Pelzmütze.

Who knows: perhaps there are [size] marks pressed into the leather lid.

Please zoom in on the picture below. The Pelzmütze on top of the pile. This picture gives you the perfect example of how the fur and the round part of the Kolpak are held by the leather brim. Picture: The cover of this excellent-French-book on the Pelzmützen.
-And mine. Eigentums: so no metal hooks.
 

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Thanks. I will ask for better photos of this area.

It's been quite an interesting discussion so far. I've learned quite a bit. Thanks!
 
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