JzP M15

Maple Creek

Maple Creek

Member
Here's one that I just pulled out of the woodwork. The manufacture's stamp is GBRJSRAEL and it's dated 1916.

Interestingly, it has what looks like a Saxon Reich kokarde.

Why do so many of these helmets surface with line eagle front plates rather than JzP front plates?

I'm looking for an original grey trim JzP front plate for this piece and have a few pickelhaube doodads I could trade (M91 grey trim EM chinstrap, EM grey domed split pins, Saxon Reich kokarde, EM grey spike, etc.)
[img]http://i1008.photobucket.com/albums/af204/maple_creek/JzP_3QtrsR.jpg[/img]
 
Sorry, don't have anything to trade, but thanks for posting the photo. I don't see any reason why it would have a non-serrated cockade. There were JzP units that used a line eagle, but I don't know if that would have continued with the M15.. I think they all went to the dragoon type long before WWI. It was discussed on a different thread. Looks like the spike may have been replaced as well, or left in a damp place apart from the helmet.

:D Ron
 
Hi Ron,

Thanks for your observations. I agree that this helmet is not correctly configured and there no way to explain this as a correct period piece. However, it has been this way for a very long time and you can see the outlines of the wappen ghost on the front of the shell.

I wondered about the spike too, but I think it is most likely original to the helmet. I think it is the correct type for a JzP helmet - taller that a line infantry spike - but please tell me if I'm wrong about this.

I wonder if this might be a war bond helmet that was slapped together immediately after WWI from parts found in German warehouses.

Mark D.

IMG_1613.jpg

IMG_1617.jpg
 
Hey Mark, your scenario sounds plausible...

Here's what I got on the difference between a regular line spike and the JZP's:
PickelhaubeSpitze-JgerzuPferdevsInfanterie-M1915.jpg
 
Thanks. I recall seeing this helpful comparison on another thread. The spike on my JzF is 86mm, which is closer to the height of the JzP spike in the photo (88 mm). On the other hand, the proportions seem closer to the line infantry spike, so I'm not sure what to conclude about this piece.

RON said:
Hey Mark, your scenario sounds plausible...

Here's what I got on the difference between a regular line spike and the JZP's:
Click to expand...
 
I'm pretty sure your spike is JZP cavalry... It might not be original to this helmet in particular due to the inconsistent aging but it sure looks like the (longer) JZP. The 2 mm difference and any other minor design variations are probably due to the various manufacturers that were out there back then.
 
Take a look at this pile of pickelhaubes. Don't you think there is a good chance that my helmet could have been assembled from parts found in this pile circa 1919? As a matter of fact, I think I see my helmet in the lower middle section of the pile. :lol: I think this may explain why this type of helmet pops up from time to time with very old, but apparently random configurations.

Still looking for the right front plate. There must be one somewhere in this pile!

from: Helmets and Headdress of the Imperial German Army 1870 - 1918 by Robert H. Rankin

PickelhaubePile_RRankin.jpg
 
Yes, I can see that your points are valid. This (to ME) looks like a definitive 'War Bond' helmet. Take a look at the missing and loose wappen on some of those helmets in the photo. It doesn't take much imagination to realize that a lot of parts were swapped and switched. After all, it's a helmet, who cares, right? If I were a kid who won a 'war bond' helmet, I'd be jazzed just to have one! I would imagine the cockade was modified by an early owner?

Another War Bond Helmet:

100_2644.jpg




:D Ron
 
Arghhh! 20,000 pickelhaubes for $1...
This picture is such a tease!
Look at all the cav. metalhemles in the front row!
I also think I see a Busby Totenkopf somewhere towards the middle left...
Where's that time machine? :cry:
 
Cool pic, don't think I have ever seen that one before. Are those covers (uberzug) mixed in with them?
 
Yes, hundreds of Uberzugs, Chinstraps, Cockades, not to mention the many different types of helmets... :cry:

And there's at least one (authentic!) Prussian Leib Husaren Pelzmütze in there (isn't that a skull encircled below?)

WarBondHelmets.jpg
 
RON said:
Yes, hundreds of Uberzugs, Chinstraps, Cockades, not to mention the many different types of helmets... :cry:

And there's at least one (authentic!) Prussian Leib Husaren Pelzmütze in there (isn't that a skull encircled below?)

WarBondHelmets.jpg
Click to expand...

Nope, that's Harold Freenbean, a warehouse worker who really wanted to immerse himself in what he considered to be a fascinating hobby. "Can y'smell th' leather Harold?"

:D Ron
 
Nope, that's Harold Freenbean, a warehouse worker who really wanted to immerse himself in what he considered to be a fascinating hobby. "Can y'smell th' leather Harold?"
Click to expand...

I laughed a lot :lol: How did you spot that Ron?

Andy
 
I found a correct Reich kokarde for this piece and traded the Saxon Reich kokarde to a happy collector friend in France to complete a Saxon helmet in his collection.

I decided to leave the front plate as is.

I added another spike comparison photo. This one compares the spike on my JzP with a regular line infantry spike. It's easier to see the difference side by side.

Got to raise funds for my GdC restoration project, so I'm putting this one on the block: http://www.ebay.com/itm/300708765686?ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1558.l2649
JzP_3QtrsR-1.jpg

JzP_SpikeComparison.jpg
 
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