Kuirassier Helmet - spot the issues

S

skelts1974

New member
Gents,

While trawling militaria sites in Europe I came across this oddity. My first thoughts were what a crock, obvious fake. Closer inspection revealed that it was a parts helmet using original parts. The shell is an 1889 Officer's model. The JzP NCO spike appeared to be an add on as did the wappen. The chin scales, kokardes and trefoils were all original. Easy fix said I.

Once it arrived (yup brought it at discount price - maxed out the credit card which resulted in tears and a tantrum from my much suffering wife - I am working overtime in my second job to pay for it). I ripped off all the pieces for a quick clean. This revealed not only the shadow of the JzP wappen, but also another one for a kuirassier eagle. The chin scales, kokardes and trefoils are in brilliant condition and I would like to think are original to the helmet. The liner has shrunk a bit over time and I had to do some work re fixing the leather to the mounting band, but it is all intact if not a little brittle and moth eaten. The green lining of the visor is quite degraded, but still present, while the liner on the lobster tail is totally gone. At some time this was painted black.

I have replaced the wappen with a reserve officers wappen and the spike with a kuirassier officers spike - sadly this part is not original but a copy purchased from spikehelmet. If anyone has or knows of an original for sale please let me know.

Happy to discuss and throw this open to the forum. I will post photos of the new look helmet after some discussion.

Oh I forgot to mention the markings - there is the number 27 stamped into the shell near the hole at the top of the helm near the spike mountings. This number is also inscribed in Roman numerals on the brass trim near one of the kokardes - facing inside of course so it can't be seen when being worn.

Regards

Steve
 
At one time Meldereiter???
http://www.pickelhauben.net/articles/Meldereiter.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
 
Joe,

Good question, but I have my doubts about this. Why you ask? Well the helmet in question is an 1889 pattern helm. My understanding is that the Meldereiter's came into existence in 1895 (so based on this logic you could be right) with most units and offlicers eventually using the 1899 pattern helm - this pattern being the classic JzP officer's helm.

The other thing that leaves doubt in my mind is the evidence of the earlier use of a Kuirassier eagle (the shadow is quite definite once polished up - that being said the shadow from he JzP plate is more defined). Looks to me like someone has 'upgraded' or 'restored' the helmet (given the shadow of the JzP this would have been done quite sometime ago).

Not sure if I have added anything of use here. Would love to hear the thoughts of others.
 
Some more photos. As I think I mentioned before I have used a repro spike - still looking for an original. Oh and yes it looks ghastly - need to age that ostentatious sucker down. This will never be a perfect helmet, but I still love it, especially at the bargain basement price!
 
Steve,

Somewhere between 1899 and in 1905. The picture is also shown in this article which will explain a lot of the questions.

http://www.pickelhauben.net/articles/Meldereiter.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
 
Joe,

Thanks. The question I have is this. Did 1 year volunteers have officer kokardes and Kleeblatten? I can see how this helmet could be a 1 year volunteer, but I thought that they wore EM kokardes?

Am I right in thinking that a Fanrich would have the officers spike and kokardes, but without the Kleeblatten?

Germans - so confusing!

Steve
 
The question I have is this. Did 1 year volunteers have officer kokardes and Kleeblatten? I can see how this helmet could be a 1 year volunteer, but I thought that they wore EM kokardes?

Am I right in thinking that a Fanrich would have the officers spike and kokardes, but without the Kleeblatten?
Click to expand...

Steve,

Outstanding question that has been many people go crazy. Really it was this question that led us to first writing books. The dealer that told us about one year volunteers seemed to be just dead wrong. And he was. There were no hard and fast rules for what an OYV could use on his helmet. So you see photographic evidence of all sorts of different combinations of enlisted and officer fittings. The indication is that it went by Regiment but even that changed over time. There are all sorts of variations. I even have one photograph of a one-year volunteer with a 100% officer helmet. Fähnrich would be the same thing. These two right positions do not fit into the modern English language military understanding. We all have tried to put this square peg into a round hole. You will see these helmets with all sorts of different liners etc. they could either be "rented" from the unit or purchased privately. These guys were separate – closer to officers – certainly not run-of-the-mill enlisted types. The real tell is that they were addressed as Sie as opposed to the informal du.

The only real serious explanation in the English language that I'm aware of is in the book The Great War Dawning. However that is self-serving.
 
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