M1846 Hanoverian Garde du Corps helmet

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krb450

New member
This is a piece I recently picked up, thinking it was just an 1840s Kurassier helmet. I was curious though why it had an enlisted spike but an officer's style cruciform base, enlisted style chinscales and extra holes above the front visor. Looking online, I stumbled across a Hanoverian Garde du Corps helmet and the light bulb turned on.

Sadly the front plate and bandeau are missing, but I am still quite pleased with owning such a rare helmet. I am sure it is far from happening, but if anyone knows a source for the missing front plate and bandeau, I'd be ever grateful! Does anyone else on the forum have one of these beautiful helmets?
 
Did you see this?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/121941475966?_trksid=p2047675.m570.l6026&_trkparms=gh1g%3DI121941475966.N34.S1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

:D Ron
 
krb450 said:
Must have just missed it! Thank you though, Ron!
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Too bad, but over $1,000 not really a deal for parts. Great restoration project though! I bid, but very low. Thought it would be fun to work on and fix up.

:D Ron
 
These helmets are real treasures. That looks like an especially nice one in good shape for the period. Plates are rare but they do turn up. No one has tried to produce a facsimile that I know of. If you have a chance or are even able to remove it, can you show us the kokarde? Its very difficult to see an original leather kokarde, Hanover or otherwise. Thank you for letting me see this. Regards, John
 
Nacuaa said:
These helmets are real treasures. That looks like an especially nice one in good shape for the period. Plates are rare but they do turn up. No one has tried to produce a facsimile that I know of. If you have a chance or are even able to remove it, can you show us the kokarde? Its very difficult to see an original leather kokarde, Hanover or otherwise. Thank you for letting me see this. Regards, John
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Here you go, John! And as far as the Prussian colors cockade, it is a very old one, but why on a Hanoverian helmet?
 
Thank you very much! I have been working on a restoration of my own and will probably have to fabricate that kokarde at some point. I've never seen one separate from the helmet. I have a collection of about seven helmets from various online sources and none of them have a kokarde on the left hand side much less a Prussian one. So that was added. It looks like a good Prussian kokarde though. Here are some examples. Also, I attach a photo of a totally mangled helmet that still had its bandeau that sold on Ebay last year to illustrate that it takes a little patience to put the plate together. Dealers like Sergio Semino and Weitze get these parts from time to time. These helmets must have been decommissioned after Hanover's defeat in 1866. I doubt the helmets were ever put to any further purpose explaining why many still have their original kokardes and fittings etc.. Hanover was always a problem for Prussia because of its association with the English Royal family until Queen Victoria was passed over in favor of a male heir and the domain became an independent state with its own king. Thanks again, John
 
On second thought I suppose its possible that when Prussia absorbed Hanover after its defeat these heavy cavalry regiments of Garde du Corps and Kurassiers were drafted in? Possibly explaining that early Prussian kokarde?? We would need to find out more about what Prussia did with Hanover's army after its defeat.
 
Hanover was always a problem for Prussia because of its association with the English Royal family until Queen Victoria was passed over in favor of a male heir and the domain became an independent state with its own king.
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This issue continued on long after the independent kingdom. It did not get even slightly resolved until the marriage of the Kaiser's daughter. fascinating subject. Lots of further reading in The Great War Dawning.

CIMG0366.jpg


hannover.jpg
 
I will take a crack at what happened to the Hanoverian troops. If I am wrong, somebody please correct me.

The Electorate of Hanover was formally dissolved after being overrun by the French in 1803 and the area remained under French rule until October 1813 when Cossack troops overran the region. Many former Hanoverian officers and soldiers fled the French occupation of 1803 to Britain. They became part of the Kings Foreign Legion (KFL) of the British army, fighting Napoleon. The KFL was disbanded on 23Dec1815 and the troops were incorporated into the army of the independent Kingdom of Hanover, which was restored in 1814 at the Congress of Vienna. George III of Great Britain was then king of Hanover.

Prussia annexed Hanover in 1866 and their army was incorporated into the newly formed X Corps. During the Franco-Prussian War, X Corps was assigned to the Second Army and fought in several battles. The X Corps became part of Imperial Germany after the unification of 1871 and remained there until WWI.
 
I have only been reading up on Hanover recently so this is fascinating. If the Hanoverian Army became the X Corps, did X Corps have a heavy cavalry regiment? The idea being X corps took on the Garde du Corps and Garde Kurassiers as a Prussian Kurassier or Reiter Regiment? This helmet is as good a shape as they come before cleaning and polishing. It seems unlikely that anyone would strip the helmet of its plate and bandeau to put on another helmet and leave all the other good stuff intact. My bandeau is actually soldered on so its not a case of just popping it off. So is it possible that the owner of this helmet was instructed to remove the Hanoverian plate and bandeau and to add a Prussian kokarde? Of course that leaves the holes in the helmet but it is curious that the helmet has what looks like a period kokarde not just any kokarde. Just a thought. I love the graphic of the Hanover horse breaking its chains and heading for home in the distance with its yellow and white flags. Thank you for the added detail of the complete paint on the kokarde in the photo... much appreciated. Here is the Knotel print of the Hanoverian Garde du Corps. The heavy cavalry regiments participated in the rout of the Prussians at the battle of Langensalza. Unfortunately the army could not unite with its allies and in the following weeks, became surrounded and forced to capitulate I understand. From his appearance in this portrait, it looks like King of Hanover George V appreciated his helmet.
 
If the Hanoverian Army became the X Corps, did X Corps have a heavy cavalry regiment?
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I think we're looking at this a bit over simplistically.This gives the impression that the Hanoverian armies simply marched over and became Prussian. The reality is that Germany annexed Hanover and raised several regiments there. Many of the soldiers that were in the Hanoverian army would be used as NCOs in the Prussian regiments.

however, these were not standing armies. There was a rotating training cycle where 20-year-old recruits would enter into the Army for a time. So really what became important were the garrisons and the traditions of the regiments. While these traditions were primarily traced to X Corps there were also others such as Oldenburg. There were two cavalry brigade's that were hand in that corps::

19. Kav. Brig., Hannover (Gen. Maj. Frhr. v. Zedlitz u. Leipe, Adj.: Rittm. v. Pelet-Narbonne) Oldenburg. D.R.19, Königs U.R. Nr. 13
20. Kav. Brig., Hannover (Gen. Maj. v. Unger, Adj.: OLt. Hans Prinz v. Ratibor und Corvey): D.R. 16, Braunschweig. H.R. 17

There was a huge amount of maneuvering politically trying to incorporate the population of that area into the kingdom of
Prussia. The regiments from Hanover were given all sorts of incentives and honorary awards to make them feel more Prussian and less Hanoverian.

I know this is going to sound self-serving but you would learn a lot from The Great War Dawning.

Many of the Hanoverians remained loyal to their Hanoverian sovereign. A substantial political party in the Imperial Reichstag, the Guelph party, continued to agitate and to hope for a restoration. This nostalgia and loyalty failed to bring about the return of the king to Hanover. George died in June 1878. His son, Ernest August III maintained his claim to the crown of Hanover. He refused to reconcile with Prussia. Consequently, the imperial German government refused to allow him to take possession of the Duchy of Brunswick, which he inherited on the extinction of the elder branch of his family in 1884. The Empire also refused to allow him to take possession of the Duchy of Brunswick when Prince Albert of Prussia, the Regent, died. You always see pictures of Hanoverian male royalty wearing the uniform of Austria until Ernest August married the daughter of Kaiser Wilhelm II, Princess Viktoria Luise on 13 May 1913. Ernest August swore his oath of allegiance to the Kaiser, was promoted to the rank of a Rittmeister and took command over the 4th squadron of Husaren-Regiment von Zieten (Brandenburgisches) Nr. 3, a regiment, which one was under the honorary command of his grandfather King George V.
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hanover1.jpg
 
joerookery said:
Hanover was always a problem for Prussia because of its association with the English Royal family until Queen Victoria was passed over in favor of a male heir and the domain became an independent state with its own king.
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This issue continued on long after the independent kingdom. It did not get even slightly resolved until the marriage of the Kaiser's daughter. fascinating subject. Lots of further reading in The Great War Dawning.
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I've wondered what would have had happened had Hanover not had its semi-Salic law, which excluded accession to the throne by a female while any male of the dynasty survived -- or if Ernest Augustus I had died before Victoria became Queen of England. In that case she could have been queen of Hanover, which could have been a problem when her daughter Princess Vicky married Friedrich Wilhelm. Perhaps the fact that Victoria was Queen of Hanover would have been enough to stop the marriage of Vicky and Friedrich Wilhelm!

Joe, you would know more than I would on this matter, but what was the British reaction to the dissolution of Hanover as an independent kingdom? I know even today the Ernst August V is the surviving "heir" to the throne and because he is part of the male line from King George II of England, had to ask permission from Queen Elizabeth to marry. So even today the would-be Kings of Hanover have that British connection!
 
I wonder if these relationships came into play when Britain called for a cessation of hostilities in the Schleswig-Holstein War in which the Hanoverians were participating as part of the German Federation Army? Hanover went into that war in 1848 wearing the tall pickelhaube but by 1866 they were turned out in the shako. That shako always looked more like the 1861 British shako than an Austrian one to me.

Thank you for the clarification. There's a Franco-Prussian War order of battle page on-line and it is clear the units are not the equivalent. It seems unlikely that two entire Hanoverian elite heavy cavalry units would just be folded into the Prussian army. So the helmet posted here remains a bit of a mystery but I still think its strange that someone would remove the plate and put a period Prussian kokarde on the helmet. Its not self-serving. I'll go find a copy of TGWD.
 
but what was the British reaction to the dissolution of Hanover as an independent kingdom?
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I don't know Peter. It's a good question. Janet is probably the best source however she is in Pensacola buying a condo.
 
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