Officer Cocades for a Kurassier Helmet Original or Reproduction

JohnS3rd

Member
Hello Folks,
Since first posting on this forum, I have started to examine my current collection of helmets. I know that the officer cockades are correct for a Prussian Officer Kurassier Helmet, and are they period or reproductions?

They were originally on an Officers Pickelhaube serving with a Dragoon Regiment. Thanks in advance for your assessment.
John
Officer Cocades for Kurassier Helmet  F.jpg
Officer Cocades for Kurassier Helmet  R.jpg
 

911car

Active member
John, these cockades are not correct for a Kurassier officer. The silver ring should have a single set of oblique streaks, not two.
 

JohnS3rd

Member
Alan,
Based on information gained at the http://www.kaisersbunker.com/hp/kokarden.htm, NCOs with Portepee have Kokarden have"one distinctive diagonal metal ribbing" ring or "streak." In contrast, Officers "Kokarden" have a "double metal ribbing ring on top of the plate.
Thanks for your quick reply to my RFI.
John
 

911car

Active member
JohnS3rd said:
Alan,
Based on information gained at the http://www.kaisersbunker.com/hp/kokarden.htm, NCOs with Portepee have Kokarden have"one distinctive diagonal metal ribbing" ring or "streak." In contrast, Officers "Kokarden" have a "double metal ribbing ring on top of the plate.
Thanks for your quick reply to my RFI.
John

This is correct... except for Prussian Kurassier Officer cockades!

L1040193.JPG
 

JohnS3rd

Member
Alan,
Thank you, I see what you mean by the example you have provided. So the set I have are approximately 67 mm wide, which helmet would they be used on?
Thanks again,
John
 

911car

Active member
JohnS3rd said:
Alan,
Thank you, I see what you mean by the example you have provided. So the set I have are approximately 67 mm wide, which helmet would they be used on?
Thanks again,
John

John, you wrote that these cockades belonged to a Dragoner officer helmet. This should make sense.
Good luck with the inventory.
 

JohnS3rd

Member
Alan, okay, would that size cockade be used on both the Dragooner officer leather and steel helmets, or just the steel helmets? I know that my question may sound redundant ](*,) However, I feel like I'm drinking from a firehose and need to have the pressure some more because there seem to be many contradictions in this hobby. In the past, I only looked at my pickelhaube as a nice addition to my collection. Thanks for the information and your patience in what seems simple.
Thanks,
John
 
Did you try a black light on them ?

When I got my black light in on the first day I checked everything I had.

2 of my Offs. helms cocardes glowed like the eyes of Satan !
 

Steve Nick

Member
[/quote]

This is correct... except for Prussian Kurassier Officer cockades!

[/quote]

A curiousity question.

I have a set of Officer Kokarden 67mm dia. M15 pattern with the double sliver ring.

I've always assumed they were worn by he heavy cavalry. Which units wore these?
 

JohnS3rd

Member
pickelhauben said:
Did you try a black light on them ?

When I got my black light in on the first day I checked everything I had.

2 of my Offs. helms cocardes glowed like the eyes of Satan !
Wow, I never thought of that; I thought that only worked on cloth items. :eek: I will have to figure out where I put my blacklight. :-k
Thanks for the tip :thumb up:
John
 

JohnS3rd

Member
I pulled on my blacklight based on Pickenhauben's comments concerning glow in the dark paint on cockade's. I found that some of the older cockades glowed. However, known repro ones (recently purchased on epay) did not glow. :? I next looked up when luminescent paint and my online research shows that "radioluminescent paint was invented in 1908 by Sabin Arnold von Sochock." (1) It was used on watch faces for many years. It is also dangerous because it had radium.
The question on why it is on original cockades is one that I cannot even begin to explain. and leads me to believe that glowing cockades are not a reliable indicator of reproduction or fake devices. :-k
Thanks for the replies :thumb up:
John

(1) Luminescent Paint, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luminous_paint
 

aicusv

Active member
radio-luminescent paint - will glow in the dark without the use of any other light source.
What's happening to the photos on the site????
 

JohnS3rd

Member
alcusv, thanks for that bit of information. However, I found it quite curious that I never noticed any glow on them until I used the blacklight.
Best regards,
John
 
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