Officer pickelhaube 92Rgt Brunswick

[Duguesclin]

Hello,
Could you please tell me if this officer's helmet from the 92nd Rgt Brunswick is authentic?
What do you think of the eagle plate?
Thank you in advance for your answers.
Laurent

 

[CLOVIS 57]

Hello,

At first glance, excellent!!!
With this type of coin, you need to focus on the Totenkopf. Access to the reverse side would be a plus, as this would allow you to detect whether it is an electrotype reproduction.
Nominative, Philippe may be able to trace the pedigree of this Lt in the Stammrolle.
I repeat, at first glance, a very beautiful and rare helmet.

 

[Jeff R]

I'll be curious to hear Tony's thoughts - he's the totenkopf guru (IR92 especially).

I agree with Clovis that seeing the reverse of the TK and wappen would be ideal. To my eye, the wappen and TK seem oddly dark compared to the rest of the fittings - the Braunschweig kokarde might have been repainted. The case label is definitely nifty, although I've not yet been able to find this gent in the Rangliste.

 

[CLOVIS 57]

I agree with Jeff R. about the cockade. The crown is not clear; it appears to have been repainted gray, and some of the paint has come off.
Normally, given the condition of the blue, the crown should be made of gold-plated brass.






This helmet was offered some time ago for a relatively modest sum as a full reproduction. Very good quality, difficult to detect after lying in the mud for a while. Fortunately, a few details give it away, such as the neck cover here!

 

[michiel]

Of course this helmets are dream pieces for all of us, years ago I refrained from buying one from a very known dealer because of advice given by forum members, especially Adler ( Karel), they were right, it was not good… I think only a tiny percentage of these helmets are genuine, only buy one with proven provenance, or at bargain price then it is worth the gamble

 

[911car]

I've not yet been able to find this gent in the Rangliste.

At least, we know he was short-sighted.

 

[Doug B]

Hard no for me. I am fortunate to own Karel’s former IR92 III Btn and used to own Tony’s example for some time as well. This does not compare, the TK certainly not and believe it to be a reproduction. The name tag on the helmkoffer I also believe is not real, merely aged and placed to help “sell” the helmet as genuine.

 

[911car]

Hard no for me. I am fortunate to own Karel’s former IR92 III Btn and used to own Tony’s example for some time as well. This does not compare, the TK certainly not and believe it to be a reproduction. The name tag on the helmkoffer I also believe is not real, merely aged and placed to help “sell” the helmet as genuine.

Same here. Duchess of Brunswick Viktoria Luise's IR92 TK helmet is enough of a pleasure to own. I was also surprised by the large name tag on the box. It looks like the common name tags found in helmets, cuirasses, and other effects that would have been photographed, printed oversize, and aged artificially. Or did they make such huge name tags?

 

[John Josef]

I didn't like the name tag it really does look as already mentioned one used the original pattern used by soldiers to mark their items and just supersized it and then added some aging to it.

When Leutnant Behns wasn't on the list of former members' serious doubt started to creep in.

If you're going to go through all this trouble, why not just look up an officer's name from the list then make your tag. That to me is ridiculous. or it may be an Easter egg left by the faker to spare the blushes of the diligent collectors willing to do the research.

I don't own an officer's helmet and have never had a real one in my hand to study, so I'll respect the members opinions with that very valuable experience. I also didn't like the lack of detail on the oak leaves but I'm not sure how it should look when compared to the EM version, but it's definitely a much better looking Wappen than most of the repros that I've seen.

It truly is scary at the lengths at which fakers will go to deceive and lets just be honest RIP COLLECTORS OFF.

 

[argonne]

No officer with this name at the JR92

DFG-Viewer: Geschichte des Braunschweigischen Infanterie-Regiments Nr. 92 im Weltkriege 1914-1918GefechtskalenderVorbemerkungenVorgeschichte des KriegesDie Mobilmachung in BraunschweigVormarschtage durch BelgienDie Schlacht von NamurDie Schlacht bei

dfg-viewer.de

Philippe

 

[coert65]

No officer with this name at the JR92

DFG-Viewer: Geschichte des Braunschweigischen Infanterie-Regiments Nr. 92 im Weltkriege 1914-1918GefechtskalenderVorbemerkungenVorgeschichte des KriegesDie Mobilmachung in BraunschweigVormarschtage durch BelgienDie Schlacht von NamurDie Schlacht bei

dfg-viewer.de

Philippe

Indeed Philipe, I have this very book in my regimental history library.

 

[KAGGR#1]

I'll be curious to hear Tony's thoughts - he's the totenkopf guru (IR92 especially).

I agree with Clovis that seeing the reverse of the TK and wappen would be ideal. To my eye, the wappen and TK seem oddly dark compared to the rest of the fittings - the Braunschweig kokarde might have been repainted. The case label is definitely nifty, although I've not yet been able to find this gent in the Rangliste.

I agree with Jeff.

Hello,
Could you please tell me if this officer's helmet from the 92nd Rgt Brunswick is authentic?
What do you think of the eagle plate?
Thank you in advance for your answers.
Laurent

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Mine is a reserve officer but note the difference in the quality
I vote no on it
mine came from am old collection and I have owned it for years
Steve

 

[911car]

I didn't like the name tag it really does look as already mentioned one used the original pattern used by soldiers to mark their items and just supersized it and then added some aging to it.

The same name tag, in normal size, is actually stuck in the shell at the usual location between plate attachments.

 

[CLOVIS 57]

Some people did not understand my first impression. At first glance, I had serious doubts. What I wanted to show is that this type of reproduction is formidable, and that at first glance, once patinated, it is undetectable without experience and knowledge. !!!
There are two scenarios:
---An authentic common Prussian infantry officer's helmet, but disguised as a ‘rare and expensive’ Brunswick helmet. Formidable! In this case, you have to focus on the Totenkopf and the ‘Fuerst’ eagle, which are the only ‘fakes’.
---A complete reproduction, as I showed above, where an experienced collector will be able to detect almost every detail (shell, silk, trimmings), even after accelerated artificial ‘ageing’.

Here we are in the first case: we must therefore appreciate the elements of speculative falsification: the eagle, the TK and the name tag.
---Philippe said that this Lieutenant is fanciful.
---I would never place a single bid on this helmet if I did not have access to the back of the Totenkopf, the only way to persuade and convince others!

 

[John Josef]

The same name tag, in normal size, is actually stuck in the shell at the usual location between plate attachments.

I've seen the normal size tag located in several locations inside Pickelhauben as well as bread bags, bread bag straps, Gas mask straps, Halsbinden, Shirts, Pants ect ect ect.

The supersized one was a BIG RED FLAG for me.

 

[argonne]

I've seen the normal size tag located in several locations inside Pickelhauben

Yes, I agree. You can also find some name tags in other places on a helmet: between the loops but inside the rear of the shell too, or even on the neckguard.
And they can be made of paper or even of cloth.

Philippe

 

[911car]

This 92R helmet has been around and the object of the same discussions for years.

 

[Gunner who?]

I may be wrong, but I think on the tag should be written „Inf.-Rgt. 92“ and not „92. Inf.-Rgt.“ Just another hint that its not authentic.

 

[Doug B]

Some people did not understand my first impression. At first glance, I had serious doubts. What I wanted to show is that this type of reproduction is formidable, and that at first glance, once patinated, it is undetectable without experience and knowledge. !!!
There are two scenarios:
---An authentic common Prussian infantry officer's helmet, but disguised as a ‘rare and expensive’ Brunswick helmet. Formidable! In this case, you have to focus on the Totenkopf and the ‘Fuerst’ eagle, which are the only ‘fakes’.
---A complete reproduction, as I showed above, where an experienced collector will be able to detect almost every detail (shell, silk, trimmings), even after accelerated artificial ‘ageing’.

Here we are in the first case: we must therefore appreciate the elements of speculative falsification: the eagle, the TK and the name tag.
---Philippe said that this Lieutenant is fanciful.
---I would never place a single bid on this helmet if I did not have access to the back of the Totenkopf, the only way to persuade and convince others!

No need to see the back of the TK on the original helmet posted. The front is not accurate to the very rare authentic ones. Just look at the eye sockets for starters should give it away as what it is.

 

[CLOVIS 57]

No need to see the back of the TK on the original helmet posted. The front is not accurate to the very rare authentic ones. Just look at the eye sockets for starters should give it away as what it is.

Yes, but only if you have something to compare it to... which isn't easy with this officer's 92R. helmet. But that's right, and I often do it, either by comparing it with period photographs, authentic items that I've been able to handle, or genuine field pieces!!!