Prussian Ersatz painted Cuirassier helmet
- Thread starter J.LeBrasseur
- Start date
pickelhauben
Well-known member
This is a totally new one for me as well.I have never seen a true felt lobster tail before.
What a beauty.
I guess I have another holy grail helmet to wish for .
Oldenburg
Well-known member
ww1czechlegion
Well-known member
I'm not so certain about the "consensus that these were made on a trial basis". I'm very skeptical about this so-called consensus, because I'm definately not in that so-called group. I hold absolutely zero remote hope that this helmet you are showing is a wartime trial basis helmet. It may or may not have some original parts on it, but I firmly believe the felt body is modern era manufactured. This topic was discussed a number of years ago on a different thread.
I have seen the questionable example that was listed for many years on the "Saxonia Militaria" web site in the UK (I am not sure if this it the helmet you're showing here, or if this is a different one that was not shown on Peter Nardini's web site). The 2nd one that I am aware of which was different, showed up for sale at the Show of Shows a few years ago as well. It's my suspicion that a skilled modern day craftsman made both of these helmets in the past 30+ years. I say this with having owned a pair of metal body lobster tail helmets in the past 3 yrs that were likely made in Germany or the UK in the past 30+ years, a Leibgendarmerie enlisted helmet, and a Saxon Garde Reiter helmet that I purchased, each for a small sum from the same old collector. Never underestimate the skills of a master craftsman and faker.
Best Wishes,
Alan
P.S., I now realize the photos of the felt helmet that John Joseph posted are from the Saxonia Militaria website. This helmet has been available and shown on Peter's website for 10+ years now. If this helmet were to be original, the British Sterling price of 1,600 Pounds is quite cheap, in my humble opinion, if this were actually an original wartime "experimental" example. I believe that the helmet sitting on the website for that many years unsold, speaks for itself.
Last edited:
ww1czechlegion
Well-known member
Congratulations on acquiring this great looking helmet James! 
kuerassier
Active member
James helmet is not a Ersatz and not a M15 KĂĽrassierhelmet. The M15 have a detachable Spike and are normally not panted fieldgrey.
It is a modell between the peacetime M89 and the M15 ones. Spike with base are brass and also the eagle, but the fittings painted fieldgrey. The body polished steel.
The cockades on this helmet are too little and look very new.
It is a modell between the peacetime M89 and the M15 ones. Spike with base are brass and also the eagle, but the fittings painted fieldgrey. The body polished steel.
The cockades on this helmet are too little and look very new.
John Josef
Well-known member
The photo's I posted are from the internet and I believe from the site you mention. I had them in an old file from years ago. I also had no idea it was still available or that they were still in business. If your saying this dealer in a crook and to be avoided it will stay that way. Thanks for that
I personally don't know the man and must admit to hoping for the best in people until learning otherwise hopefully from info from other collectors and not by getting burned.
If its a modern era production which it could very well be could you point me to who is making them or to any information on who may have made it. I think it looks very well done and would love to see it closer up and maybe even pick one up if the price is right to study.
With all due respect if its bad and I respect your option that it is that still doesn't explain the other one I seen in a US grouping many years ago. Sadly I didn't get it and unfortunately that was many years before cellphones or I would have snapped some pictures. Like I mentioned in my initial post its very unique and something you don't forget easily and I still remember how it was in crap condition and had all grey painted fittings. The grey fittings in James' fine helmet are what stirred the memories.
I have no idea if it was made on a trial bases or not but that would certainly explain the rarity and I've heard it said which really is just a story and we never buy on a story. So it is what it is..
Usually someone making a reproduction would make more then one. I'd have to think with all the quality collectors several with more then the 50 years of collecting I have would have come across one of those reproductions at some point which makes me still believe in the originality of at least one of the two.
Having seen one in a very poor state years ago still gives me hope that someday I'll see another and this time I will be in a better position financially to pull the trigger. I certainly wouldn't be the first person hunting for their personal white buffalo
Speaking of fakers, having been collecting Militaria for such a long time sadly I'm very very aware at just how good they can be. In fact I know of certain dealers that I stay away from no matter what they sell. One has been flooding the market with painted helmets and chin straps for decades and has even written a book on guess what ? steel helmets. Sadly It can be a very scary hobby at times.
KAGGR#1
Well-known member
I would not call him a crook. I have dealt with him on smaller items .All went well .The photo's I posted are from the internet and I believe from the site you mention. I had them in an old file from years ago. I also had no idea it was still available or that they were still in business. If your saying this dealer in a crook and to be avoided it will stay that way. Thanks for that
I personally don't know the man and must admit to hoping for the best in people until learning otherwise hopefully from info from other collectors and not by getting burned.
If its a modern era production which it could very well be could you point me to who is making them or to any information on who may have made it. I think it looks very well done and would love to see it closer up and maybe even pick one up if the price is right to study.
With all due respect if its bad and I respect your option that it is that still doesn't explain the other one I seen in a US grouping many years ago. Sadly I didn't get it and unfortunately that was many years before cellphones or I would have snapped some pictures. Like I mentioned in my initial post its very unique and something you don't forget easily and I still remember how it was in crap condition and had all grey painted fittings. The grey fittings in James' fine helmet are what stirred the memories.
I have no idea if it was made on a trial bases or not but that would certainly explain the rarity and I've heard it said which really is just a story and we never buy on a story. So it is what it is..
Usually someone making a reproduction would make more then one. I'd have to think with all the quality collectors several with more then the 50 years of collecting I have would have come across one of those reproductions at some point which makes me still believe in the originality of at least one of the two.
Having seen one in a very poor state years ago still gives me hope that someday I'll see another and this time I will be in a better position financially to pull the trigger. I certainly wouldn't be the first person hunting for their personal white buffalo
Speaking of fakers, having been collecting Militaria for such a long time sadly I'm very very aware at just how good they can be. In fact I know of certain dealers that I stay away from no matter what they sell. One has been flooding the market with painted helmets and chin straps for decades and has even written a book on guess what ? steel helmets. Sadly It can be a very scary hobby at times.
Steve
John Josef
Well-known member
Hi Steve,
Like I said I don't know the man and try to take dealers for their word Alan said he doesn't believe the description behind the Helmet or that the Helmet is original as the man has described it on his website and other members here liked the comment so I figured he or they must know something about him or the helmet I don't.
If someone is purposely trying to deceive with the intension to profit financially I thought crook would be a fitting word but maybe it sounds harsh. I really don't know how else to describe someone who would behave in such a way. If indeed that is the case here, personally I really don't know otherwise I wouldn't have saved the photo's.
It certainly looked like the one I remember seeing but in way better condition.
I remember looking at items the man was selling on his site and didn't see any red flags.
KAGGR#1
Well-known member
I think the price of 1,600 is a indication of what it is
If it was the real deal the price would be much higher IMO
I have not read his description of the helmet
so I can't say
Steve
