Prussian Felt Ersatz

[Peter B]

My latest find and a bit of an enigma.

The label has it made by "Abteilung Berthold Lissner Guben" from what I can see and that seems to be a hat maker in Berlin.

It is hard felt, looks period, and the Wappen and Spike Base look like they belong together. It has one brass grommet and brass side posts. Also has a name inside.

The strange part is the very brittle but clearly WWII style liner. It does not look like it has been put in after as the thread and holes are perfect. It is very stiff and old leather.

Got it for a very good price. Just need to get a spike now.

Thoughts on the liner? Sewn into a shell after the war maybe but not long after?

Name looks like it might be something Schmidt and I can't tell what the stamp on the rear visor is?

Peter

 

[b.loree]

Another kijiji find Pete? I had another felt helmet with that maker name in it so that is totally legit. I am wondering about the spike support disc, has it been repainted ? I see pitting but no rust visible. Anyway, an interesting piece and I have never seen a WW 2 liner stitched into a haube before.

 

[Peter B]

Yes another Kijiji find Brian. I think the paint is original and similar to others I have seen.

Peter

 

[Peter B]

Another kijiji find Pete? I had another felt helmet with that maker name in it so that is totally legit. I am wondering about the spike support disc, has it been repainted ? I see pitting but no rust visible. Anyway, an interesting piece and I have never seen a WW 2 liner stitched into a haube before.

Oops, had a senior moment Brian.

I read your question too quickly and I thought you were talking about the detachable spike base. Had another look at the spike support disc and it's hard to say. I can see a bit of rust and pitting bit the pitting looks to be under the paint. I don't think the spike brads have been removed though as I don't see the normal scratching you would expect. A couple of minor ones so I suppose it is possible someone did it very carefully?

The weirdest thing is still the liner. Unless there had never been a liner or the person had a sewing machine that would match the holes exactly it looks like it is original to the helmet.

So of course my dilemma now is do I remove it and put one of your excellent hand made replacement liners in it or leave it as-is?

Cheers.

Peter

 

[pickelhauben]

The actual helmet looks good to me.
That is a WWII German helmet liner that came out in the early 1930s after the m-18s.
Who ever has sewn it in has done a great job , but it should not be on this felt.
The support disc may be original but it certainly has been repainted.
It kind of looks ground dug to me and repainted.

 

[John Josef]

There are lots of possibilities but unfortunately none of those lead to this Helmet being constructed during the correct time frame, sorry but I think that explains why it was a good price.

As so painlessly and diplomatically pointed out by Brian the spike support disc's obvious signs of pitting but no rust can only mean one thing it's been painted.

Which then opens up the thoughts to look at the spike retaining studs more closely. Then when doing so from the top they show a different color which would be ok but when looking from the bottom again rust but no signs on the disk.

Then you add the 1930s style liner added much later and you have several things that just don't add up.

IMO the shell is good, and someone found it and decided to build the Helmet around it.

If it came from Latvia that would explain more and sadly would put doubt in my mind about the felt just having a factory tag and markings also added.

Its I terrible thing but when one bad thing shows, it really makes you look deeper at everything else.

Hope you're not pissed Peter, but it's just my opinion and thought process when looking at a helm. I hope I'm wrong and would gladly be so. regards John Josef

 

[Peter B]

Thanks John Josef.

The helmet was from in Canada so I think I tend to agree with you that someone did a bit of fixing up. I do think the shell and fittings are all original. And the spike studs do have a lot of rust on them.

The Wappen has definitely been on this helmet a long long time as it has left quite deep impressions in the felt.

And yes it looks like the spike disc has been repainted.

I will probably put one of Brian's liners in it.

Cheers.

Peter

P.S. These types of comments are exactly why I posted the helmet and they are all well appreciated.