jimturinetti
Member
I recently got this Württemberg Tschako and I'm looking for any information that you all might have regarding it. I think the name on the sweat band is Krone and the word below the name is _____ Korps.
Württemberg Tschako
- Thread starter jimturinetti
- Start date
kaiser
Well-known member
Becose of the schinning in the last picture it is hard to see what is written in front of the word korps
If i would make a wild guess i think its a word with 4 letters
Maybe freikorps or something
If you have a blacklight you would be able to see more of the contours of the words written in it
Jonas
If i would make a wild guess i think its a word with 4 letters
Maybe freikorps or something
If you have a blacklight you would be able to see more of the contours of the words written in it
Jonas
GardeUlan
Well-known member
Hi,
It looks to me like an officer’s shako of the Württembergische Gebirgsbataillon. The unit was part of the German Alpenkorps in WWI. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alpenkorps_(German_Empire" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false
Maybe that’s why there’s the word Korps written in the shako.
The Württembergische Gebirgsbataillon was set up in the beginning of WW I.
http://wuerttgebbataillon1915.npage.de/fuehrung-der-wuerttembergischen-schneeschuh-und-gebirgs-bataillon.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
On one of the pictures shown on this website you can see the shako, too.
Probably the most famous officer of the unit was Erwin Rommel.
These shakos are extremely hard to find...
Sadly by far the most of the Württemberg shakos on the market are fakes or assembled by using the star from an officer cartridge box of Dragoons 26 like Steve said.
For me an indicator would be the shape of the star, meaning curved rather than flat, and the type of the shako body being a war production.
In the end you always need to have such a piece in your hands in order to judge it properly.
By the way, have a look at lot 278 of this auction:
https://www.the-saleroom.com/de-de/auction-catalogues/auktionshaus-andreas-thies-e-k/catalogue-id-sraukb10001/lot-3f18e2f9-6e85-447d-99ec-a423017872e0" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.andreas-thies.de/onTEAM/grafik/A58_161_192.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Best wishes,
GardeUlan
It looks to me like an officer’s shako of the Württembergische Gebirgsbataillon. The unit was part of the German Alpenkorps in WWI. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alpenkorps_(German_Empire" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false
Maybe that’s why there’s the word Korps written in the shako.
The Württembergische Gebirgsbataillon was set up in the beginning of WW I.
http://wuerttgebbataillon1915.npage.de/fuehrung-der-wuerttembergischen-schneeschuh-und-gebirgs-bataillon.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
On one of the pictures shown on this website you can see the shako, too.
Probably the most famous officer of the unit was Erwin Rommel.
These shakos are extremely hard to find...
Sadly by far the most of the Württemberg shakos on the market are fakes or assembled by using the star from an officer cartridge box of Dragoons 26 like Steve said.
For me an indicator would be the shape of the star, meaning curved rather than flat, and the type of the shako body being a war production.
In the end you always need to have such a piece in your hands in order to judge it properly.
By the way, have a look at lot 278 of this auction:
https://www.the-saleroom.com/de-de/auction-catalogues/auktionshaus-andreas-thies-e-k/catalogue-id-sraukb10001/lot-3f18e2f9-6e85-447d-99ec-a423017872e0" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.andreas-thies.de/onTEAM/grafik/A58_161_192.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Best wishes,
GardeUlan
GardeUlan said:Hi,
It looks to me like an officer’s shako of the Württembergische Gebirgsbataillon. The unit was part of the German Alpenkorps in WWI. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alpenkorps_(German_Empire" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false
Maybe that’s why there’s the word Korps written in the shako.
The Württembergische Gebirgsbataillon was set up in the beginning of WW I.
http://wuerttgebbataillon1915.npage.de/fuehrung-der-wuerttembergischen-schneeschuh-und-gebirgs-bataillon.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
On one of the pictures shown on this website you can see the shako, too.
Probably the most famous officer of the unit was Erwin Rommel.
These shakos are extremely hard to find...
Sadly by far the most of the Württemberg shakos on the market are fakes or assembled by using the star from an officer cartridge box of Dragoons 26 like Steve said.
For me an indicator would be the shape of the star, meaning curved rather than flat, and the type of the shako body being a war production.
In the end you always need to have such a piece in your hands in order to judge it properly.
By the way, have a look at lot 278 of this auction:
https://www.the-saleroom.com/de-de/auction-catalogues/auktionshaus-andreas-thies-e-k/catalogue-id-sraukb10001/lot-3f18e2f9-6e85-447d-99ec-a423017872e0" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.andreas-thies.de/onTEAM/grafik/A58_161_192.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Best wishes,
GardeUlan
Wuertemberg Gebirgstruppen officers wore silvered chinscales, not gold in colour. If the chinscales are original this Tschako cannot be for a mountain troop officer.
KAGGR#1
Well-known member
Not trying to "knock " the helmet
but
if Garde Korps is written in by hand
would that not be a bad sign ?
Could someone have converted a
Garde Jager or Garde Schutzen Officers
helmet ?
There is a maker with name " Garde du Corps "
but their name is stamped into the liner
I have for of their helmets to a J z P unit
what do others think ?
Steve
but
if Garde Korps is written in by hand
would that not be a bad sign ?
Could someone have converted a
Garde Jager or Garde Schutzen Officers
helmet ?
There is a maker with name " Garde du Corps "
but their name is stamped into the liner
I have for of their helmets to a J z P unit
what do others think ?
Steve
edwin
Active member
Nice tschako and it would be great if it turned out to be from the alpen korps.
Information on the württembergische gebirgs bataillon can be found on:
http://pierreswesternfront.punt.nl/content/2012/02/guebwiller--rimbach--hirzstein" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Regards,
Edwin
Information on the württembergische gebirgs bataillon can be found on:
http://pierreswesternfront.punt.nl/content/2012/02/guebwiller--rimbach--hirzstein" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Regards,
Edwin
jimturinetti
Member
My thanks to all of you who responded to my request. I believe that since the Tschako has silver chin scales it is for an officer in either the Luftschiffer or Telegraph units. The Mountain Troops wore a brass chin scale.
I was hoping that someone would be able to find a Rangeliste reference for some one named Krone in one of those units. Thanks again for all of your input.
I was hoping that someone would be able to find a Rangeliste reference for some one named Krone in one of those units. Thanks again for all of your input.
Jim,
I think I can say with some certainty that no officer with the name of Krone served in the Royal Württemberg Army during WW1. The nearest contender who is a possibility depending on just how readable the name in the shako is, would be:
Leutnant d.R. Eugen Kromer of Fernsprech-Abteilung Nr. 13 who would of course be entitled to wear the Telegraph pattern shako.
Regards
Glenn
I think I can say with some certainty that no officer with the name of Krone served in the Royal Württemberg Army during WW1. The nearest contender who is a possibility depending on just how readable the name in the shako is, would be:
Leutnant d.R. Eugen Kromer of Fernsprech-Abteilung Nr. 13 who would of course be entitled to wear the Telegraph pattern shako.
Regards
Glenn
jimturinetti
Member
Thank you Bruno and Glenn.
I could say that the switch on the chin scales was a test to see who was watching, but that would be lame. Let's just attribute it to old age and be done with it. Thanks for catching the flip flop Bruno.
Glenn, thanks for the info about the Telegraph officer. That could be the name on the liner. Do you have any more info on Lt. Kromer?
I could say that the switch on the chin scales was a test to see who was watching, but that would be lame. Let's just attribute it to old age and be done with it. Thanks for catching the flip flop Bruno.
Glenn, thanks for the info about the Telegraph officer. That could be the name on the liner. Do you have any more info on Lt. Kromer?
Jim,
unfortunately not. It is just a 1916 one-line entry in the Württemberg "Militär-Verordnungsblatt" gazetting his promotion from the rank of Vizewachtmeister d.R. (Offizierstellvertreter) to Leutnant d.R. He was under the control of Landwehrbezirk Reutlingen.
Unlike the Prussian Militär-Wochenblatt, the wartime editions of those publications detailing the personal occurrences of the other contingents (Bavaria, Saxony and Württemberg) continued to be fully name-indexed. That being the case, it was possible to definitively exclude the name Krone in the case of Württemberg.
Regards
Glenn
unfortunately not. It is just a 1916 one-line entry in the Württemberg "Militär-Verordnungsblatt" gazetting his promotion from the rank of Vizewachtmeister d.R. (Offizierstellvertreter) to Leutnant d.R. He was under the control of Landwehrbezirk Reutlingen.
Unlike the Prussian Militär-Wochenblatt, the wartime editions of those publications detailing the personal occurrences of the other contingents (Bavaria, Saxony and Württemberg) continued to be fully name-indexed. That being the case, it was possible to definitively exclude the name Krone in the case of Württemberg.
Regards
Glenn
JzPf
Well-known member
Jim
A quick look at the Ehrenrangliste 1914-1918 shows:
Lt.a.D. Karl Kromer 10th Wuttemburg IR 180
Ober Lt.a.D. Anton Kromer 10th Wuttemberg IR 180
Lt. Kromer, KIR 145
Lt.a.D. Krone, Telegraph Batt 5
Krone, Garrison Administration, IV Armee Korps.
...for what it's worth.
Dennis
A quick look at the Ehrenrangliste 1914-1918 shows:
Lt.a.D. Karl Kromer 10th Wuttemburg IR 180
Ober Lt.a.D. Anton Kromer 10th Wuttemberg IR 180
Lt. Kromer, KIR 145
Lt.a.D. Krone, Telegraph Batt 5
Krone, Garrison Administration, IV Armee Korps.
...for what it's worth.
Dennis