Officer Silk Liners
- Thread starter b.loree
- Start date
joerookery
Well-known member
I am not so sure this date is accurate. Certainly that is the date that is used in conventional wisdom however, the leather liner was available at different retailers all the way up to the war. It seems as though the leather one was less expensive. And I agree that the cloth ones were more comfortable. But I do not think it was a sharp date of change. Rather I think it happened over time and still not completely. With more than one helmet in the closet it seems as though one of those would be top floor and the other somewhat more service-oriented.
jimturinetti
Member
Adler and Joe,
Thank you very much for your help. I had thought that it wasn't until 1900. This info will help me a lot.
Jim
Thank you very much for your help. I had thought that it wasn't until 1900. This info will help me a lot.
Jim
pickelhauben
Well-known member
A few months late to the party but there are some beautiful helmets posted here !!!!!!
Thank you all for sharing.
Thank you all for sharing.
A Prussian General's liner:
The helmet.
An example of the Satin Officer liner.
Another Satin example from a Mecklenburg Helme.
The silk liner removed from the calfskin sweatband. The liner is in 2 halves with 4 creases, one in each corner so it will fit the oval of the shell. The liner is cut larger than the shell so that it can be tack stitched to the scalloped edge of the sweatband. Usually, the small "tack stitches" are found between the scallops. You can see 2 seams where the 2 halves meet, a thin rattan reed was inserted into these which caused the silk to dome up into the shell. Most times these reeds will be broken. The silk was first hand stitched to the sweatband at both ends, then the rest of the liner was tack stitched to the scalloped edge.
A near pristine example of a Garde officer liner. Usually these are soiled from use especially if the officer used a hair cream to slick down his hair. The small separations are typical of this ribbed silk cloth. In the worst cases the silk disintegrates into a spaghetti like state!
The above liner pulled down and out of the mid war Garde shell. Note the small tack stitches and surprisingly the use of an M91 officer kokarde filled in by the cardboard backing. This Garde helmet is from my collection and was brought back by a CN medical officer. It has a pe war wappen and spike but all other fittings are zinc.
The helmet.
An example of the Satin Officer liner.
Another Satin example from a Mecklenburg Helme.
The silk liner removed from the calfskin sweatband. The liner is in 2 halves with 4 creases, one in each corner so it will fit the oval of the shell. The liner is cut larger than the shell so that it can be tack stitched to the scalloped edge of the sweatband. Usually, the small "tack stitches" are found between the scallops. You can see 2 seams where the 2 halves meet, a thin rattan reed was inserted into these which caused the silk to dome up into the shell. Most times these reeds will be broken. The silk was first hand stitched to the sweatband at both ends, then the rest of the liner was tack stitched to the scalloped edge.
A near pristine example of a Garde officer liner. Usually these are soiled from use especially if the officer used a hair cream to slick down his hair. The small separations are typical of this ribbed silk cloth. In the worst cases the silk disintegrates into a spaghetti like state!
The above liner pulled down and out of the mid war Garde shell. Note the small tack stitches and surprisingly the use of an M91 officer kokarde filled in by the cardboard backing. This Garde helmet is from my collection and was brought back by a CN medical officer. It has a pe war wappen and spike but all other fittings are zinc.
This is one of the most pristine officer liners I have seen, manufactured by AWES one of Germany's top makers....like new! The liner belongs to a Prussian field artillery officer helmet that has been sent for some restoration. Unfortunately, the condition of the outside of the helmet does not match what we see here. Most times, we only see the remains of that AWES trade mark.
I love these ribboned sweat bands, very much "top of the line".
Gold embossed. The company even marked the underside of their officer spike bases!
I love these ribboned sweat bands, very much "top of the line".
Gold embossed. The company even marked the underside of their officer spike bases!
Thanks for the new photos Sandy, I have seen that second one twice before on helmets I have worked on. It is very different than most, quite stiff and almost feels like nylon. The first one I have never seen before on a pickelhaube It reminds me of a French kepi liner somehow.
Sandmann
Well-known member
Yes, I have not seen this wavy silk liner in a Pickelhaube too, but it was a Bavarian reserve officer's helmet that was auctioned on February 26th, 2021
Source: https://www.lot-tissimo.com/de-de/a...chivelot-f850a8a4-64ff-44ac-8c23-acbe00d281a2
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ww1czechlegion
Well-known member
I first saw the blue stiff liner with the white dots many years ago on a dealer's website and I thought it was a fake liner. I thought this type of liner was a joke, some strange replacement that someone had placed inside the helmet. Not so, I discovered over the years.
I have seen this a couple times since in other helmets.
And a few years ago I saw my first one in person with my own eyes. It was a 33rd Division Officer WW1 bring back helmet that is in a museum. Sadly it is not being taken care of very well.
The liner is inside of a guard officer helmet that has cheap wartime zinc fittings, and much of the gilding had lifted off from the zinc fittings on the helmet.
Brian is correct in stating the liner material is like a stiff and very coarse, almost nylon type of material. I have heard someone refer to this liner as a "dish rag" or "dish wash cloth" in reference to this stiffness and coarse, almost cheap like material from which it is made.
If I remember correctly, I believe the other two helmets which I have seen photos of had wartime zinc fittings on them. So maybe this is some sort of "ersatz" cloth liner which was used in some of the wartime officer helmets???
I'll post a couple photos of this helmet which I have handled in person at the museum where I discovered it. It was on display in 1997, and when I saw it again, it was in storage and probably will not be on display again for anytime in the foreseeable future.
Best Wishes,
Alan
It is from a Bavarian officer helmet, with an interesting kocarde, attached os the link,
Pickelhaube - Bayern schwarze Glocke mit gold. Beschlägen, Spitze auf Kreuzblatt mit Sternschraub
Live auf Los 3314 in der Auktion 245.Auktion bei Keup Kunstauktion bieten.
www.lot-tissimo.com
Sandmann
Well-known member
Alan may be right. The helmet I posted with the blue liner and the white dots I posted was a wartime helmet too. It was an officer in a Reserve-Infantry-Regiment from Württemberg:
Objektdetail - 2 Pickelhauben Preussen und Württemberg, Anfang 20.Jh. -
1 x lederne Pickelhaube mit dem württembergischen Wappen und der Aufschrift "furchtlos und trew", darauf angebracht ein Kreuz. Helm weist fast mittig gebrochene Schuppenkette auf, ...
auktionen.eppli.com
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