Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

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nzef1940
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Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by nzef1940 » Mon Jun 17, 2019 7:18 pm

Any thoughts or comments regarding this haube appreaciated.

Unit attribution if possible and noting the non Hessen rear vent, I assume the vent is non issue private purchase anomily?

Thanks in advance.
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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by nzef1940 » Mon Jun 17, 2019 7:20 pm

2
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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by Spiker » Tue Jun 18, 2019 1:01 am

Looks good,cant’ see any red flags .
From 1895 on the foot troops were given this spine with vent.
The inside is typical for private purchase.
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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by nzef1940 » Tue Jun 18, 2019 1:05 am

Thanks Ed

Much appreciated.
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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by USMC-EOD » Tue Jun 18, 2019 9:48 am

I hate to post without offering anything to contribute, but man, that is a really nice piece. Congrats.

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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by KAGGR#1 » Tue Jun 18, 2019 11:36 am

Silver trim ? A Dragoon ?
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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by SkipperJohn » Tue Jun 18, 2019 6:33 pm

KAGGR#1 wrote:
Tue Jun 18, 2019 11:36 am
Silver trim ? A Dragoon ?
Steve McFarland
I believe that Dragoon Regiments 23 and 24 both used the Hessen Wappen in silver with silver trim.
Also, Hesse used a cruciform base with four equal length arms. Other than some police units, they were the only ones who did this.
I questioned the vented spine, so after hearing that this was normal, I would say you have a great helmet.
Beautiful piece.

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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by nzef1940 » Tue Jun 18, 2019 8:42 pm

Thanks chaps, much appreciated.
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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by Spiker » Wed Jun 19, 2019 12:32 am

I was under the impression that everything was brass. :???:
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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by aicusv » Wed Jun 19, 2019 11:27 am

If dragoon shouldn't it have a square front visor?
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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by argonne » Wed Jun 19, 2019 12:33 pm

A beautiful reservist hessian dragoon helmet, not absolutely private purchased, because of the EM pattern bright trim on the front visor. We often have already seen some particular things on german cavalry EM helmets, like those "many squared tongues" liner and Wappen with screws and nuts.

As it should be, round front visor for hessian dragoon helmets and round chinscales on M91 side posts.

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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by nzef1940 » Wed Jun 19, 2019 6:30 pm

Thanks Philippe

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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by aicusv » Thu Jun 20, 2019 11:19 am

Thanks Philippe, some day I'll get all the details about the helmets straight.
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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by randy trawnik » Sat Jun 22, 2019 3:33 pm

The helmet has to be from the 116th Infantry Regiment. This regiment is the only standard Hessen (plain Hessen front plate) regiment that was allowed to wear a black plume for parades.

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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by b.loree » Sat Jun 22, 2019 6:13 pm

I have always loved the Hessen helmets, congratulations!
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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by 911car » Sat Jun 22, 2019 6:32 pm

randy trawnik wrote:
Sat Jun 22, 2019 3:33 pm
The helmet has to be from the 116th Infantry Regiment. This regiment is the only standard Hessen (plain Hessen front plate) regiment that was allowed to wear a black plume for parades.
Randy you are right, IR116 did wear a Haarbusch in parade. So did, too, both Hessian Dragoner regiments. Are the fittings in maillechort that turned yellowish with age, as is frequently seen? It seems to be the case, therefore the helmet should be for a Dragoner, as confirmed by Philippe (and yes, they did have the vent on the rear spine; an exception for Dragoner). If the fittings would be made of yellow metal then we would have an IR116 helmet (which, however should bear flat chinscales ...). nzef1940 should confirm the colour.
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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by Tony without Kaiser » Sat Jun 22, 2019 10:54 pm

911car wrote:
Sat Jun 22, 2019 6:32 pm
//(and yes, they did have the vent on the rear spine; an exception for Dragoner)//
I did not know this.

Facinating. Thank you Bruno. :read2:
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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by Scottplen » Sat Jun 22, 2019 11:01 pm

Very nice !

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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by argonne » Sun Jun 23, 2019 4:14 am

911car wrote:
Sat Jun 22, 2019 6:32 pm
they did have the vent on the rear spine; an exception for Dragoner).
Larcade wrote that this rear vent has been first introduced on the hessian dragoon helmets in the year 1895, as the five vent holes in the spike neck. This was exactly the same for Württemberg dragoons but never for Preußen, Baden, Oldenburg and Mecklenburg dragoons.
Second thing: from 1895 on, the parade Trichter remains fluted on hessien dragoon helmets. All foot units wore then a plain Trichter.

nzef 1940 should confirm us that the convex chinscales are german silver.

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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by Spiker » Sun Jun 23, 2019 4:59 am

:-s Actually, it was the 117th who was awarded the black plume.

But for the love of God is it silver or brass ?
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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by 911car » Sun Jun 23, 2019 5:22 am

argonne wrote:
Sun Jun 23, 2019 4:14 am
911car wrote:
Sat Jun 22, 2019 6:32 pm
they did have the vent on the rear spine; an exception for Dragoner).
Larcade wrote that this rear vent has been first introduced on the hessian dragoon helmets in the year 1895, as the five vent holes in the spike neck. This was exactly the same for Württemberg dragoons but never for Preußen, Baden, Oldenburg and Mecklenburg dragoons.
Second thing: from 1895 on, the parade Trichter remains fluted on hessien dragoon helmets. All foot units wore then a plain Trichter.

nzef 1940 should confirm us that the convex chinscales are german silver.

Philippe
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Philippe, my DR26 Wuertemberg helmet marked 1913 does not have the vented spine but the usual two "nails"...

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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by 911car » Sun Jun 23, 2019 5:28 am

Spiker wrote:
Sun Jun 23, 2019 4:59 am
:-s Actually, it was the 117th who was awarded the black plume.

But for the love of God is it silver or brass ?
Ed, you are right, IR117 wore the Haarbusch, but so did IR116. I know that Laine's book states that it did not, but I think this is a mistake.

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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by argonne » Sun Jun 23, 2019 7:12 am

911car wrote:
Sun Jun 23, 2019 5:22 am
Philippe, my DR26 Wuertemberg helmet marked 1913 does not have the vented spine but the usual two "nails"...
Bruno,
this will not be the last time, the "written" being in contradiction with the "observed"....Especially with imperial cavalry helmets...Regulations were not always 100% applied. The old elements were first used on new helmets. Nothing was thrown away in the german army.
JLL wrote that thing about the rear vent on post 1895 württemberg helmets in his Tome II, page 130.

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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by Spiker » Sun Jun 23, 2019 7:15 am

Oh Ok Bruno , but are you sure 116 should bear flat chinscales ?
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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by 911car » Sun Jun 23, 2019 12:52 pm

Spiker wrote:
Sun Jun 23, 2019 7:15 am
Oh Ok Bruno , but are you sure 116 should bear flat chinscales ?
This was the regulation for all Hessian infantry regiments from 1897, Ed. We know by experience and from JL Larcade, though, that this was not followed by officers (except for those in JR115) who kept the curved chinscales. So many variations and particularities among Hessian helmets...
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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by Spiker » Mon Jun 24, 2019 12:04 am

Yes Bruno ,And every now and then they come with star retainers 8)

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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by joerookery » Sun Jul 07, 2019 7:46 am

Not just limited to helmets – look at these covers!
Imageps156 by Joe Robinson, on Flickr
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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by edwin » Tue Jul 09, 2019 3:28 pm

Great haube!

Regards,

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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by nzef1940 » Fri Jul 26, 2019 4:41 am

Thanks guys

Definitely brass

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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by nzef1940 » Fri Jul 26, 2019 4:45 am

Excuse flash, but proves brass.
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Re: Hessen NCO Reserve Pickehaube

Post by argonne » Sat Jul 27, 2019 3:42 am

If all brass, then only one possibility remains: TB18 helmet (Train Bataillon 18), with garrison in Darmstadt.

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