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Schirmmütze M1917??

Posted: Tue May 01, 2012 7:14 pm
by RON
Gentlemen, would a Prussian Schirmmütze with the following qualify as an 'M1917'?

> Black visor (as seen on the M1910 or older)
> Feldgrau centerband (replacing the branch of service color centerband for all branches, same as on the late war Einheits/Universal Model)
> the piping however remained red (unlike the Universal Model which had its piping turned to green for more camouflage)

In other words, this cap is basically identical to an M1910 with camouflage band, only the latter is fixed/permanent/part of the hat's centerband.

And if this visor would indeed qualify as an 'M1917', why didn't it come with a green visor from the previous design upgrade (M1915 Schirmmütze)?? :-k

Re: Schirmmütze M1917??

Posted: Sun Aug 12, 2012 11:43 am
by ccj
Ron, do you have a cap in your possession to show us?

Re: Schirmmütze M1917??

Posted: Sun Aug 12, 2012 12:09 pm
by RON
Here you go Charles: http://www.pickelhaubes.com/bb/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=7358" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It is actually a Saxon Schirmmütze described by the seller as an 'M1917'...

Re: Schirmmütze M1917??

Posted: Tue Aug 14, 2012 2:08 pm
by RON
Too many overlapping/conflicting regulations for 1 country... 8-[

Re: Schirmmütze M1917??

Posted: Fri May 10, 2013 10:35 pm
by ccj
It looks like a 1910 with a camo band sewn to the central band leaving the top red piping exposed. The camo band looks extremely close or exactly like the cap material. That makes me wonder if it was ordered as a seen in the photo. Its a nice SAXON NCO cap but hard to say without having in hand.

Re: Schirmmütze M1917??

Posted: Sun May 19, 2013 12:29 pm
by Chip Minx
It's certainly not a Prussian style (which would include Saxons) universal Schirmmütze. Only a Bavarian cap would have the band in the same material as the rest of the cap. But a Bavarian example would not have red piping. It looks like it
could be a period piece, but is most likely some sort of private purchase hybrid.

What an M17 is, I'm sure I don't know.

Chip

Re: Schirmmütze M1917??

Posted: Wed May 29, 2013 9:09 pm
by ccj
Is it possible the band has been sewn on tightly to the red band?

Re: Schirmmütze M1917??

Posted: Thu May 30, 2013 4:01 am
by RON
Unfortunately, I don't have the hat with me yet. Once I do, I'll check and let you know...

Re: Schirmmütze M1917??

Posted: Wed Aug 21, 2013 4:22 pm
by dante
Interesting I have a similar Schirmmütze with an old label "Jager Bl Nr14" (extra red piping aside)

Re: Schirmmütze M1917??

Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 4:24 pm
by RON
Hello everyone. It's been a while I didn't post any new photos which doesn't mean I stopped collecting...

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Re: Schirmmütze M1917??

Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 11:31 pm
by aicusv
Shouldn't there be three lines of piping?

Re: Schirmmütze M1917??

Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 2:15 pm
by RON
Not necessarily... Imagine a green camo band sewn on the middle (red) (infantry) band only in this case the "green camo band" has nothing underneath and is an integral part of the hat...
There were lots of variants past the M1910 I presume and this was one of them.
Definitely authentic (and from a trustworthy source) including the paint on the cockades which doesn't glow under UV and neither does the US Vet's label inside...

Re: Schirmmütze M1917??

Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 1:44 pm
by RON
Speaking of the Vet's label; it would be cool to trace him back if anyone here has access to such records.

He either mailed it to himself or to his father maybe:

"J. L. Rohan" of Oakland

If anyone can find anything about him, please let me know...

Re: Schirmmütze M1917??

Posted: Mon Oct 06, 2014 11:11 am
by mchap
I am just going assume "Oakland" is the city he was in when the tag was created. There happens to be a 2345 Waverly St. in Oakland with an old home thats been subdivided into crummy office space. Maybe thats where your hat once was... fun to speculate.

During the first half of the 20th century Oakland was an affluent community, some of it is still very nice but those pockets are surrounded by some of the worst ghettos in N. California. I digress...

https://www.google.com/maps/@37.8124595 ... wbKtgQ!2e0" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Re: Schirmmütze M1917??

Posted: Fri Oct 10, 2014 3:11 pm
by timp_be
Hello.

For me it's a post WW1 cap, Reichwehr years 20?

Best regards

timp_be